|
Home > Archive > microsoft.public.certification > June 2002 > SOUND OFF --- Instructor Lead Classes & Internet Access
You are viewing an archived Text-only version of the thread.
To view this thread in it's original format and/or if you want to reply to
this thread please [click here]
| Author |
SOUND OFF --- Instructor Lead Classes & Internet Access
|
|
|
| OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen to
me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or CON
are appreachiated.
... I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't wait
to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
like sending me an near death exam voucher...
Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get the
extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
off time.... no other excuse for the time period as all
students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok the
IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So during
the three weeks between boring questions and review
material those of us with any brains were able to multi-
task and surf for study material / questions ect while
contributing to the class enviornment with our knowledge.
Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made us
work for the money.
Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials... Same
STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK OK I
get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
research... no problem... The instructor was basically
reading from the book and gave little insight into other
areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself or
perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he was
dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt at
this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a lot
about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking, Terminology...
If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
The next day there is no web access. It has been cut off
by our instructor as : "disruptive, potential virus
problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course and
not seeing any "disruption"I'm currious what the true
motivation is behind the Black Out.
Now there are several issues from both sides to present
the school has had extensive problems in the past...
unfortunately instead of applying patches thier answer is
simply cut the line.... Now this is what is distrupting
the class...... My insistance that it is a necessary part
of the course and a learning tool to be used at all times
during the course... granted there will be times when it
is incompatable but to term it outright disruptive... I
don't know.
Thier Stand is : It can lead to Inappropriate Use and
abuse leading to students not following class, repeat
questions, ect 2) Virus problems and 3)system update
issues in the classroom environment (updates and new
software not being compatable with classroom objectives)
The solution has been to provide a single access terminal
on each floor to allow webmail access and research
activiites. 1:45 ratio computers:students with
approximately 1 hr lunch =1.1 minutes each student if used
efficiently. We may or may not have access during lab
weeks at instructors descretion.
Now I could handle all this If I was informed while doing
due dilligence to source my instructor led training
however all locations that I examined stated that the
internet is available in the classroom... seems to be a
standard availability. So I left that out of my decision
making chart..... After checking with all that it was
indeed available. The school I choose had a good
reputation was well attended and offered CCNA and CCSA as
well as a full Win2k MCSE and A+ By far the best range of
certification available.
Now I wish I could just take the tests but I find myself
here after being trained by my local college in Micro
Computer System Support our own little mcss which us
students termed the mess... anyway we got exposure and
basic training but no certifications just the college
certificate.
My position is that the internet helps to provide access
to this newsgroup,(technet/training/certification), the
Microsoft Website, updated technical information on
Technet, msdn, ect, not to mention the host of sites that
are tailored to this certification efforts. Additionally
it enables us to keep abreast of virus development,
vulnerabilities and other security issues.
I'd like to hear from both sides on this as I don't buy
the 'disruptive' label and think its a cop out for someone
who can't engage his audience. Please label your response
PRO or CON so we can sort and quote the responses and
general comments would be appreachiated.
Thanks
James
| |
| Tom Helms 2002-06-22, 7:03 pm |
| If you're attending a training class, that's what you should concentrate
on--surfing the web is not an activity for class time.
"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:933b01c2074e$f48d2710$9ae
62ecf@tkmsftngxa02...
> OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen to
> me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or CON
> are appreachiated.
>
> .. I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
> classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
> it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't wait
> to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
> mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
> knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
> afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
> through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
> like sending me an near death exam voucher...
>
> Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
> night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get the
> extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
> off time.... no other excuse for the time period as all
> students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
> admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
> there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok the
> IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So during
> the three weeks between boring questions and review
> material those of us with any brains were able to multi-
> task and surf for study material / questions ect while
> contributing to the class enviornment with our knowledge.
>
> Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made us
> work for the money.
>
> Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials... Same
> STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK OK I
> get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
> research... no problem... The instructor was basically
> reading from the book and gave little insight into other
> areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself or
> perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he was
> dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt at
> this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a lot
> about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking, Terminology...
> If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
>
> The next day there is no web access. It has been cut off
> by our instructor as : "disruptive, potential virus
> problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
> anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
> would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course and
> not seeing any "disruption"I'm currious what the true
> motivation is behind the Black Out.
>
> Now there are several issues from both sides to present
> the school has had extensive problems in the past...
> unfortunately instead of applying patches thier answer is
> simply cut the line.... Now this is what is distrupting
> the class...... My insistance that it is a necessary part
> of the course and a learning tool to be used at all times
> during the course... granted there will be times when it
> is incompatable but to term it outright disruptive... I
> don't know.
>
> Thier Stand is : It can lead to Inappropriate Use and
> abuse leading to students not following class, repeat
> questions, ect 2) Virus problems and 3)system update
> issues in the classroom environment (updates and new
> software not being compatable with classroom objectives)
>
> The solution has been to provide a single access terminal
> on each floor to allow webmail access and research
> activiites. 1:45 ratio computers:students with
> approximately 1 hr lunch =1.1 minutes each student if used
> efficiently. We may or may not have access during lab
> weeks at instructors descretion.
>
> Now I could handle all this If I was informed while doing
> due dilligence to source my instructor led training
> however all locations that I examined stated that the
> internet is available in the classroom... seems to be a
> standard availability. So I left that out of my decision
> making chart..... After checking with all that it was
> indeed available. The school I choose had a good
> reputation was well attended and offered CCNA and CCSA as
> well as a full Win2k MCSE and A+ By far the best range of
> certification available.
>
> Now I wish I could just take the tests but I find myself
> here after being trained by my local college in Micro
> Computer System Support our own little mcss which us
> students termed the mess... anyway we got exposure and
> basic training but no certifications just the college
> certificate.
>
> My position is that the internet helps to provide access
> to this newsgroup,(technet/training/certification), the
> Microsoft Website, updated technical information on
> Technet, msdn, ect, not to mention the host of sites that
> are tailored to this certification efforts. Additionally
> it enables us to keep abreast of virus development,
> vulnerabilities and other security issues.
>
> I'd like to hear from both sides on this as I don't buy
> the 'disruptive' label and think its a cop out for someone
> who can't engage his audience. Please label your response
> PRO or CON so we can sort and quote the responses and
> general comments would be appreachiated.
>
> Thanks
> James
>
>
>
| |
|
| Ah yes, agreed but I"m not "surfing" as indicated... I am=20
furthering my research while the idiots are studying=20
ping....
>-----Original Message-----
>If you're attending a training class, that's what you=20
should concentrate
>on--surfing the web is not an activity for class time.
>
>"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:933b01c2074e$f48d2710$9ae
62ecf@tkmsftngxa02...
>> OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen to
>> me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or CON
>> are appreachiated.
>>
>> .. I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
>> classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
>> it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't=20
wait
>> to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
>> mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
>> knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
>> afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
>> through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
>> like sending me an near death exam voucher...
>>
>> Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
>> night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get=20
the
>> extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
>> off time.... no other excuse for the time period as=20
all
>> students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
>> admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
>> there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok=20
the
>> IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So=20
during
>> the three weeks between boring questions and review
>> material those of us with any brains were able to multi-
>> task and surf for study material / questions ect while
>> contributing to the class enviornment with our=20
knowledge.
>>
>> Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made us
>> work for the money.
>>
>> Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials...=20
Same
>> STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK=20
OK I
>> get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
>> research... no problem... The instructor was basically
>> reading from the book and gave little insight into other
>> areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself=20
or
>> perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he=20
was
>> dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt at
>> this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a=20
lot
>> about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking,=20
Terminology...
>> If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
>>
>> The next day there is no web access. It has been cut off
>> by our instructor as : "disruptive, potential virus
>> problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
>> anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
>> would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course and
>> not seeing any "disruption"I'm currious what the true
>> motivation is behind the Black Out.
>>
>> Now there are several issues from both sides to present
>> the school has had extensive problems in the past...
>> unfortunately instead of applying patches thier answer=20
is
>> simply cut the line.... Now this is what is distrupting
>> the class...... My insistance that it is a necessary=20
part
>> of the course and a learning tool to be used at all=20
times
>> during the course... granted there will be times when it
>> is incompatable but to term it outright disruptive... I
>> don't know.
>>
>> Thier Stand is : It can lead to Inappropriate Use and
>> abuse leading to students not following class, repeat
>> questions, ect 2) =CD{=9Dw=C0=1F=1B=07=C4=1As:=E
Cva:=CC"=0B=10 =
=EC~=05Virus=20
problems and 3)system update
>> issues in the classroom environment (updates and new
>> software not being compatable with classroom objectives)
>>
>> The solution has been to provide a single access=20
terminal
>> on each floor to allow webmail access and research
>> activiites.
| |
| Tom Helms 2002-06-22, 7:03 pm |
| Nothing I can say is going to convince you--so I'll stick to my original
remarks--you're free to believe as you wish. The training facility is free
to do as they wish. If you find their actions unacceptable, talk to their
management OR better yet, have 'your internet access' guaranteed in writing.
"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:941d01c20756$66eaf010$19e
f2ecf@tkmsftngxa01...
Ah yes, agreed but I"m not "surfing" as indicated... I am
furthering my research while the idiots are studying
ping....
>-----Original Message-----
>If you're attending a training class, that's what you
should concentrate
>on--surfing the web is not an activity for class time.
>
>"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:933b01c2074e$f48d2710$9ae
62ecf@tkmsftngxa02...
>> OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen to
>> me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or CON
>> are appreachiated.
>>
>> .. I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
>> classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
>> it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't
wait
>> to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
>> mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
>> knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
>> afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
>> through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
>> like sending me an near death exam voucher...
>>
>> Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
>> night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get
the
>> extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
>> off time.... no other excuse for the time period as
all
>> students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
>> admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
>> there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok
the
>> IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So
during
>> the three weeks between boring questions and review
>> material those of us with any brains were able to multi-
>> task and surf for study material / questions ect while
>> contributing to the class enviornment with our
knowledge.
>>
>> Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made us
>> work for the money.
>>
>> Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials...
Same
>> STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK
OK I
>> get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
>> research... no problem... The instructor was basically
>> reading from the book and gave little insight into other
>> areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself
or
>> perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he
was
>> dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt at
>> this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a
lot
>> about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking,
Terminology...
>> If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
>>
>> The next day there is no web access. It has been cut off
>> by our instructor as : "disruptive, potential virus
>> problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
>> anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
>> would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course and
>> not seeing any "disruption"I'm currious what the true
>> motivation is behind the Black Out.
>>
>> Now there are several issues from both sides to present
>> the school has had extensive problems in the past...
>> unfortunately instead of applying patches thier answer
is
>> simply cut the line.... Now this is what is distrupting
>> the class...... My insistance that it is a necessary
part
>> of the course and a learning tool to be used at all
times
>> during the course... granted there will be times when it
>> is incompatable but to term it outright disruptive... I
>> don't know.
>>
>> Thier Stand is : It can lead to Inappropriate Use and
>> abuse leading to students not following class, repeat
>> questions, ect 2) {w s:va:" ~Virus
problems and 3)system update
>> issues in the classroom environment (updates and new
>> software not being compatable with classroom objectives)
>>
>> The solution has been to provide a single access
terminal
>> on each floor to allow webmail access and research
>> activiites.
| |
|
| No, Tom I am here to listen to the debate. I would like=20
to see valid points brought up on both sides... Yes I am=20
for the idea... especially when an instructor says "I'm=20
Not sure but I'll look into it" Or "you can find more=20
information online." I personally would like to go there=20
and see what is online or look at that example site. I=20
have escalated this to management and even further if=20
necessary as I believe I have been misled along the garden=20
path until I paid up and now the rules are changing. I'm=20
not here to waste my time and money I'm here to learn. If=20
I can't learn in the early stages then maybe I'll learn=20
online..... So instead of researching online I'm relegated=20
to surfing "published" material that may or maynot be the=20
most current available. I guess I just grew up in a=20
different era where the internet is part of everything. I=20
also know that it is not outlandish to ask for such a=20
simple thing... after all do we have to ask nudists not to=20
walk arround nude.... no we find that disruptive and=20
unacceptable..... If I was surfing or playing games I=20
could see the point but closed to research & learning...=20
and no I"m not here to fill the instructors gaps... Im=20
here to learn and paid damn good money to do it.
>-----Original Message-----
> Nothing I can say is going to convince you--so I'll=20
stick to my original
>remarks--you're free to believe as you wish. The training=20
facility is free
>to do as they wish. If you find their actions=20
unacceptable, talk to their
>management OR better yet, have 'your internet access'=20
guaranteed in writing.
>
>
>"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:941d01c20756$66eaf010$19e
f2ecf@tkmsftngxa01...
>Ah yes, agreed but I"m not "surfing" as indicated... I am
>furthering my research while the idiots are studying
>ping....
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>If you're attending a training class, that's what you
>should concentrate
>>on--surfing the web is not an activity for class time.
>>
>>"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:933b01c2074e$f48d2710$9ae
62ecf@tkmsftngxa02...
>>> OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen=20
to[co
lor=darkred]
>>> me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or=20[/color]
CON[c
olor=darkred]
>>> are appreachiated.
>>>
>>> .. I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
>>> classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
>>> it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't
> wait
>>> to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
>>> mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
>>> knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
>>> afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
>>> through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
>>> like sending me an near death exam voucher...
>>>
>>> Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
>>> night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get
> the
>>> extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
>>> off time.... no other excuse for the time period as
> all
>>> students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
>>> admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
>>> there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok
> the
>>> IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So
> during
>>> the three weeks between boring questions and review
>>> material those of us with any brains were able to=20[/color]
multi- [colo
r=darkred]
>>> task and surf for study material / questions ect while
>>> contributing to the class enviornment with our
>knowledge.
>>>
>>> Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made=20[/color]
us[co
lor=darkred]
>>> work for the money.
>>>
>>> Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials...
> Same
>>> STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK
>OK I
>>> get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
>>> research... no problem... The instructor was basically
>>> reading from the book and gave little insight into=20[/color]
other
>>> areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself
> or
>>> perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he
> was
>>> dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt=20
at[co
lor=darkred]
>>> this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a
> lot
>>> about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking,
>Terminology...
>>> If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
>>>
>>> The next day there is no web access. It has been cut=20[/color]
off[c
olor=darkred]
>>> by our instructor as : "disruptive, potential virus
>>> problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
>>> anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
>>> would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course=20[/color]
and[c
olor=darkred]
>>> not seeing any "disruption"I'm curriou=CD[/color]
{=9Dw=C0=1F=C8=03< ~=05@=B4e=03@=CCS`
> =EC<=05s what the true
>>> motivation is behind the Black Out.
>>>
>>> Now there are several issues from both sides to present
>>> the school has had extensive problems in the past...
>>> unfortunately instead of applying patches thier answer
> is
>>> simply cut the line.... Now this is what
| |
| Mister Sandman 2002-06-22, 7:03 pm |
| I think the class might not be so boring if you got into it and interacted
with the teacher. If no one is paying attention, the instructor will just
rattle off lines from the book. If students are inspired, and ask questions
about more detail, maybe the teacher will start making it interesting. If
the instructor is any good, he should be able to tailor the class to the
students' needs. Every tech class I've ever taken has been like that. If
the instructor isn't teaching you anything, you should talk to him about it.
Be outgoing.
I think you'll get out what you put in, and what you want to get out. I
think if you surf the net all day looking for information, you'll be really
good at surfing the net for information by the time you finish the class.
Don't think about the money, you could blow all that in one night in Vegas.
Think about the time and the opportunity.
Consider asking the instructor tons of questions and trying to move things
along faster, and writing down questions you have. Then look them up on the
net at home.
Sandman
"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:933b01c2074e$f48d2710$9ae
62ecf@tkmsftngxa02...
> OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen to
> me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or CON
> are appreachiated.
>
> .. I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
> classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
> it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't wait
> to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
> mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
> knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
> afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
> through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
> like sending me an near death exam voucher...
>
> Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
> night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get the
> extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
> off time.... no other excuse for the time period as all
> students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
> admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
> there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok the
> IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So during
> the three weeks between boring questions and review
> material those of us with any brains were able to multi-
> task and surf for study material / questions ect while
> contributing to the class enviornment with our knowledge.
>
> Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made us
> work for the money.
>
> Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials... Same
> STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK OK I
> get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
> research... no problem... The instructor was basically
> reading from the book and gave little insight into other
> areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself or
> perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he was
> dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt at
> this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a lot
> about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking, Terminology...
> If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
>
> The next day there is no web access. It has been cut off
> by our instructor as : "disruptive, potential virus
> problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
> anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
> would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course and
> not seeing any "disruption"I'm currious what the true
> motivation is behind the Black Out.
>
> Now there are several issues from both sides to present
> the school has had extensive problems in the past...
> unfortunately instead of applying patches thier answer is
> simply cut the line.... Now this is what is distrupting
> the class...... My insistance that it is a necessary part
> of the course and a learning tool to be used at all times
> during the course... granted there will be times when it
> is incompatable but to term it outright disruptive... I
> don't know.
>
> Thier Stand is : It can lead to Inappropriate Use and
> abuse leading to students not following class, repeat
> questions, ect 2) Virus problems and 3)system update
> issues in the classroom environment (updates and new
> software not being compatable with classroom objectives)
>
> The solution has been to provide a single access terminal
> on each floor to allow webmail access and research
> activiites. 1:45 ratio computers:students with
> approximately 1 hr lunch =1.1 minutes each student if used
> efficiently. We may or may not have access during lab
> weeks at instructors descretion.
>
> Now I could handle all this If I was informed while doing
> due dilligence to source my instructor led training
> however all locations that I examined stated that the
> internet is available in the classroom... seems to be a
> standard availability. So I left that out of my decision
> making chart..... After checking with all that it was
> indeed available. The school I choose had a good
> reputation was well attended and offered CCNA and CCSA as
> well as a full Win2k MCSE and A+ By far the best range of
> certification available.
>
> Now I wish I could just take the tests but I find myself
> here after being trained by my local college in Micro
> Computer System Support our own little mcss which us
> students termed the mess... anyway we got exposure and
> basic training but no certifications just the college
> certificate.
>
> My position is that the internet helps to provide access
> to this newsgroup,(technet/training/certification), the
> Microsoft Website, updated technical information on
> Technet, msdn, ect, not to mention the host of sites that
> are tailored to this certification efforts. Additionally
> it enables us to keep abreast of virus development,
> vulnerabilities and other security issues.
>
> I'd like to hear from both sides on this as I don't buy
> the 'disruptive' label and think its a cop out for someone
> who can't engage his audience. Please label your response
> PRO or CON so we can sort and quote the responses and
> general comments would be appreachiated.
>
> Thanks
> James
>
>
>
| |
|
| Very Constuctive... Thank you. This is the approach I=20
have been taking. Its a little sad that I was waiting to=20
let others catch up... seriously I think they let the bar=20
a little low in this class. A collegue of mine suggested=20
I just wait a little longer and then they will start=20
dropping like flies... hopefully... in the mean time Yes I=20
understand the learning strategies in involment...that is=20
why I wanted to be involved with the entire picture not=20
just the simple things that they keep rehashing... I've=20
brought a pile of cd's and have beeen installing evals on=20
one system and using the "spare" to do the class labs... I=20
think a web link would help the situation personally but=20
I'm wondering if I"m not just going to grab the books and=20
write... this is driving me crazy... I just wanted that=20
extra buffer bettween getting it and knowing it so I can=20
tweek and troubleshoot with ease and speed.... yes I know=20
it means knowing the interface...
anyway Thanks guys.... Will let you know what happens...=20
keep up with the comments.....
offline in lotus land...
>-----Original Message-----
>I think the class might not be so boring if you got into=20
it and interacted
>with the teacher. If no one is paying attention, the=20
instructor will just
>rattle off lines from the book. If students are=20
inspired, and ask questions
>about more detail, maybe the teacher will start making it=20
interesting. If
>the instructor is any good, he should be able to tailor=20
the class to the
>students' needs. Every tech class I've ever taken has=20
been like that. If
>the instructor isn't teaching you anything, you should=20
talk to him about it.
>Be outgoing.
>
>I think you'll get out what you put in, and what you want=20
to get out. I
>think if you surf the net all day looking for=20
information, you'll be really
>good at surfing the net for information by the time you=20
finish the class.
>Don't think about the money, you could blow all that in=20
one night in Vegas.
>Think about the time and the opportunity.
>
>Consider asking the instructor tons of questions and=20
trying to move things
>along faster, and writing down questions you have. Then=20
look them up on the
>net at home.
>
>Sandman
>
>"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:933b01c2074e$f48d2710$9ae
62ecf@tkmsftngxa02...
>> OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen to
>> me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or CON
>> are appreachiated.
>>
>> .. I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
>> classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
>> it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't=20
wait
>> to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
>> mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
>> knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
>> afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
>> through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
>> like sending me an near death exam voucher...
>>
>> Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
>> night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get=20
the
>> extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
>> off time.... no other excuse for the time period as=20
all
>> students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
>> admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
>> there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok=20
the
>> IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So=20
during
>> the three weeks between boring questions and review
>> material those of us with any brains were able to multi-
>> task and surf for study material / questions ect while
>> contributing to the class enviornment with our=20
knowledge.
>>
>> Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made us
>> work for the money.
>>
>> Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials...=20
Same
>> STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK=20
OK I
>> get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
>> research... no problem... The instructor was basically
>> reading from the book and gave little insight into other
>> areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself=20
or
>> perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he=20
was
>> dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt at
>> this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a=20
lot
>> about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking,=20
Terminology...
>> If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
>>
>> The next day there is no web access. It has been cut off
>> by our instructor as=CD{=9Dw=C0=1FQ=06D=C3=F8Oo=
F6=16P=EC?
(=14 =EC=E9=07 : "disruptive, potential virus
>> problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
>> anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
>> would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course and
>> not seeing any "disruption"I'm currious what the true
>> motivation is behind
| |
| Brenda Hutton 2002-06-22, 7:03 pm |
| Not saying either PRO or CON, just giving food for thought.
I understand your frustration. However, unless your machine is in the back
of the classroom, it IS disruptive to the students behind and around you.
Mouse clicks do make noise and distract your neighbors, as does typing when
no one else in the classroom is typing. I've had many complaints in my
department's user group meetings about people checking their mail and typing
during the meeting.
It is amazing how loud typing sounds in the back when the only other noise
in the room is the speaker in the front.
"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:862b01c2076b$cf8cc700$9ee
62ecf@tkmsftngxa05...
No, Tom I am here to listen to the debate. I would like
to see valid points brought up on both sides... Yes I am
for the idea... especially when an instructor says "I'm
Not sure but I'll look into it" Or "you can find more
information online." I personally would like to go there
and see what is online or look at that example site. I
have escalated this to management and even further if
necessary as I believe I have been misled along the garden
path until I paid up and now the rules are changing. I'm
not here to waste my time and money I'm here to learn. If
I can't learn in the early stages then maybe I'll learn
online..... So instead of researching online I'm relegated
to surfing "published" material that may or maynot be the
most current available. I guess I just grew up in a
different era where the internet is part of everything. I
also know that it is not outlandish to ask for such a
simple thing... after all do we have to ask nudists not to
walk arround nude.... no we find that disruptive and
unacceptable..... If I was surfing or playing games I
could see the point but closed to research & learning...
and no I"m not here to fill the instructors gaps... Im
here to learn and paid damn good money to do it.
>-----Original Message-----
> Nothing I can say is going to convince you--so I'll
stick to my original
>remarks--you're free to believe as you wish. The training
facility is free
>to do as they wish. If you find their actions
unacceptable, talk to their
>management OR better yet, have 'your internet access'
guaranteed in writing.
>
>
>"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:941d01c20756$66eaf010$19e
f2ecf@tkmsftngxa01...
>Ah yes, agreed but I"m not "surfing" as indicated... I am
>furthering my research while the idiots are studying
>ping....
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>If you're attending a training class, that's what you
>should concentrate
>>on--surfing the web is not an activity for class time.
>>
>>"jw" <persistentvision@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:933b01c2074e$f48d2710$9ae
62ecf@tkmsftngxa02...
>>> OK Let's sound off group. If you don't want to listen
to[co
lor=darkred]
>>> me bow out now... only positive contributions PRO or[/color]
CON[c
olor=darkred]
>>> are appreachiated.
>>>
>>> .. I made the mistake of taking an instructer lead
>>> classs... already paid for.... and am in the middle of
>>> it... I'm bored to tears in the first half and can't
> wait
>>> to hear something new... ( going for the full meal deal
>>> mcse w/ cisco & a+) I'm doing it for the paper and the
>>> knowledge so I want to hear what is going on.I can't
>>> afford to take the tests twice (so I am going to sit
>>> through this if it kills me)...unless one of you feels
>>> like sending me an near death exam voucher...
>>>
>>> Anyway I went through the A+ section during a 3 week
>>> night contingent... (basically they didn't want to get
> the
>>> extra space so they shuffled us into a class during the
>>> off time.... no other excuse for the time period as
> all
>>> students were full time enrolled) During the A+ some
>>> admin left the internet on...can't say who but it was
>>> there when we found the gateway and dns servers... (ok
> the
>>> IP's were given to us to test as part of class) So
> during
>>> the three weeks between boring questions and review
>>> material those of us with any brains were able to[/color]
multi- [colo
r=darkred]
>>> task and surf for study material / questions ect while
>>> contributing to the class enviornment with our
>knowledge.
>>>
>>> Classes were great the instructor engaged us and made[/color]
us[co
lor=darkred]
>>> work for the money.
>>>
>>> Now to the dayshift classes Networking Essentials...
> Same
>>> STuff again.. IP Subnetting, PING, OS Versions.... OK
>OK I
>>> get it already... So walla over to the web to do other
>>> research... no problem... The instructor was basically
>>> reading from the book and gave little insight into[/color]
other
>>> areas...perhaps he was teaching a class beneath himself
> or
>>> perhaps he was just "going by the book" reguardless he
> was
>>> dull and uninteresting for those of us who were adapt
at[co
lor=darkred]
>>> this phase.... ( now I don't know it all but I know a
> lot
>>> about this stuff IP, PING , Subnet masking,
>Terminology...
>>> If I did know it all I wouldn't be here right?)
>>>
>>> The next day there is no web access. It has been cut[/color]
off[c
olor=darkred]
>>> by our instructor as : "disruptive, potential virus
>>> problems, testlab classroom can't be modified" and
>>> anything else he could throw at the wall to see if it
>>> would stick. After Paying $14000 cnd for the course[/color]
and[c
olor=darkred]
>>> not seeing any "disruption"I'm curriou[/color]
{w <~@e@S`
> <s what the true
>>> motivation is behind the Black Out.
>>>
>>> Now there are several issues from both sides to present
>>> the school has had extensive problems in the past...
>>> unfortunately instead of applying patches thier answer
> is
>>> simply cut the line.... Now this is what
|
|
|
|
|