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Home > Archive > Certifications and IT jobs/Salaries > June 2003 > Thoughts on the IT job market
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Thoughts on the IT job market
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| onoski 2003-06-20, 7:06 am |
| I was just wondering what's everyone's opinion on the IT job market if it's still worth pursuing a career in the I.T. sector considering all the recent happenings leading from the dot com boom and burst to the present lay offs and what not. If you do think the IT job market is going to resurrect then what areas of IT is best to pursuit, the M$ way or the Cisco or database route.
Your contributions and insight on this matter would be greatly appreciated. Cheerio as I ain't even thinking of givin up either what about U? | |
| jackiechan 2003-06-20, 11:43 am |
| Onoski,
You are delusional. Computers are doing what they are meant to be doing, that is, replacing human intervention and work. Why work when a computer can do your job! Think about it. If you are looking for job security you are looking at the wrong industry. If you are not employed in the I.T industry now you are facing an uphill battle. Even if you land an I.T job it will not be what you want or not what you want in terms of $$$.
In terms of MCSE or CISCO cert, at the moment don't waste your money. Consider LINUX or LINDOWS. The best things are often free. The licensing fee that MSFT charges is really a license for them to print tonnes of money. | |
| ANDRONDA 2003-06-20, 12:52 pm |
| I would not listen to JC.
Technology is everywhere from ATM’s to casinos to airports to hospitals and virtually everywhere you turn. People with skills are still in demand, though probably not always in the places you would expect to see it (i.e. in a fancy office building). You simply have to get your foot in the door and work up the chain. This will take persistence and hard work.
MCSA/MCSE and other certs are certainly a plus, probably a necessity, but will not ensure job placement by themselves. There is no substitute for experience, and while employed there is no substitute for hard work. Period.
I am no Einstein. I clawed my way into an IT job and am very happy with it. The pay is fantastic and the experience is top notch. I am not lucky. I worked hard and worked smart and every day I develop my skills to stay sharp, and always keep customer focus. This is what it takes. To me, there is an evolution taking place. The lazy, the incompetent and the “short-cut seekers” are being left behind, and they are going down screaming. Those who are sharp, and who are willing to make the sacrifices are moving in. | |
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| ClintonN 2003-06-20, 9:26 pm |
| I work for a small company that never needed an IT person on hand... That is until they got a more sophisticated network. Before that I worked for them mixing chemicals and before that I worked for them packaging products! I started going to school while mixing chemicals (who wants to do that when they grow up?)I am 25 now. So while are business grew so did our need for newer technologies which need a little more care. My company went from a windows 98 workgroup to an Active Directory/XP pro network with routers, switches, databases, e-mail servers, erp/mrp server, etc. So my answers to your question is hell yeah!!! I am constantly learning inside and outside of work. At work I run into challenging problems, I learn different aspects of business, and I research new tech. to implement. At home I play around with Linux, Unix, and a little bit of programming. If your wondering what areas to concentrate in look at Job adds in your area and couple it with some business skills! Sorry for being long winded! | |
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| IT is still here, but just need some high-level skill and experiences.
Don't expect everything on Support level.
Programming and designing area need people, but also need experience worker.
It is hard to get in, but one you are in. You are easy to find job and very exciting to work on the latest tech. | |
| ANDRONDA 2003-06-21, 3:16 pm |
| Clinton has the right idea. I had a similar story. I worked in manufacturing for ten years and because we had no one on-site to fix the technology problems (PC’s, networks, MRP, phone lines etc.) I kept playing around and learning how to do it all. Soon I was indispensable as the “go to” guy to keep things running. While all this was gong on I was also getting my certifications and after a while I put my resume on the streets and highlighted those experiences along with the certifications. The company I work for was not looking for a geeky IT guy. They wanted someone who could respond and fix problems under pressure. Down time is unacceptable. I beat out a lot of guys from HP and Dell and other laid off technology people. I think this is because most of them were expecting an easy ride. It probably showed in the interviews. | |
| DivxGuy 2003-06-22, 12:13 am |
| quote:
The lazy, the incompetent and the “short-cut seekers” are being left behind,
You really think that all the structurally unemployed CompSci Masters degrees out there are "lazy" and "incompetent?"
The IT field is saturated, because the labor supply grew to accomodate an unsustainable tech boom during the Nineties, which once collapsed, left hordes of highly qualified professionals high and dry (including yours truly).
Another dark cloud hanging over the field is offshore outsourcing, which threatens to render many North American software professionals redundant. In the words of one IT analyst, "maintenance programmers are going to have to find something else to do with their lives." Gee, it's great that we're being told this now, when we're almost finished with expensive upgrading programs (two years ago, the experts said the market would soon recover and we should be patient and keep our skills up).
Me and my classmates in the Bachelors program are hoping that the market will recover at some point, but we are realistic, and are already investigating alternative careers, like medical technicians and the trades.
RD | |
| mmgm76 2003-06-22, 5:24 pm |
| I have to agree with DivxGuy. IT became so hyperinflated during the nineties, coupled with the webfront facing of corporate america, in addition to all of the Y2K spending to bring hardware up to snuff. Dust settled, we have an unstable outlook on IT futures, yet we are propping up the false IT economy through the ventures of all of the "corner store" IT certification and education schools. To each their own; all are welcome to make a dollar in whichever way suits them, I just feel sorry for the continuing onslaught of people that are being duped into thinking IT is the future, and that they should spend $1000's in order to try to get their piece of the pie. Fact is, there still is, and always will be, top money for the elite few that know how to architect and engineer solutions that deal with extremely difficult technology. However, the up-and-coming newbie to IT will never gain this experience through their expensive lesson via IT certs/education. I think education is great, and I think all people should do what they can to make themselves a little better each day, but I would bank more on getting degrees vs. fly-by-night guitar play to Win2k admin schools.
Please don't mistake this post as someone trying to keep people from moving to IT.....just trying to offer realistic perspective from someone that has been blessed with great success in this industry. | |
| ClintonN 2003-06-22, 9:40 pm |
| Having cert/education in IT is great but it's really hard to stand on those skills alone. You have to couple it with other skill sets in other fields (accounting, banking, manufacturing,etc.) I think everyone has a chance to do well in this field if they have the dedication and apptitude. I went to school with a guy that worked for IBM(as a SA) who couldn't troubleshoot a problem with a NIC. If anything these types of people are going to get weeded out, creating places for the laid off and the newbies (which I'm still a member of.) And hopefully these "get your MCSE in two weeks" will go out of business and they won't be able to rip anymore people off. | |
| ANDRONDA 2003-06-23, 8:57 am |
| I do not think that ALL unemployed IT people are lazy and I did not even say that. I think Clinton said it better than I could in his last post. What he so succinctly stated is exactly what I am talking about. | |
| BigC2004 2003-06-24, 9:38 am |
| In case no one has noticed, we are in the middle of one of the worst recessions in our economy in a long time. There are limited job opportunities in every field, not just the IT field. Even bartenders are having problems finding jobs. It is horrible out there right now. Take it from me, cuz I know. I worked in technical support for 2 years, then was let go. It has been almost a year now that I have worked in the industry but I am still working hard and learning more every day to get back into the field. I can not believe that things can get much worse then they are now, so eventually the IT industry and the economy will start to get back to where it once was. Until then prepare yourself, so that when things get good, you are ready to go. | |
| ClintonN 2003-06-24, 10:17 am |
| I look at computerjobs.com everyday just to look. A lot of jobs post for a day or two then disappear. Just have to keep looking. | |
| Bingram 2003-06-24, 12:09 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by BigC2004
In case no one has noticed, we are in the middle of one of the worst recessions in our economy in a long time.
We are not even close to having "one of the worst" recessions in our economy, even in recent memory.
Indicators were much, much worse in 1980-1984. Heck, we were even worse off in 1990 than now! And that time period was not close to the scale of the economic disaster we all call the great depression.
There is work out there on the market, if you are willing to work. I wish I had a dollar for every student I've met who's looking for some magic IT job that pays $$$$. Hey, even when the economy was booming in the mid and late 1990s, there were no six figure jobs for entry level IT pros.
Personally, my income has almost doubled since 2000. Then I was working full time in your standard repair shop. Now I am am consultant/contract IT implementor. I don't have slow weeks. People are still paying for IT pros to fill needs. So don't tell me the jobs aren't there.
Reality folks. You may have to move to a better job market. You may have to start at a level you feel is below your tallents and then work up. But the jobs are there. | |
| BigC2004 2003-06-24, 1:56 pm |
| What about the entry level IT professional?? Where are the jobs for those individuals?? There are none. That is what we are talking about here. Not employment for someone who has 10 years of experience, or 50 IT certs. | |
| ClintonN 2003-06-24, 2:11 pm |
| Your best bet BigC2004 is find a company that has a decent size IT staff. Get your foot in the door even if it's something remotely close to what you want to do. Then try to get on their IT staff. Most companies post their job openings internally. When they come up apply for it. You've already got some experience you just need the oportunity. For people that don't have experience volunteer some work for your company, church, user groups, etc. | |
| DivxGuy 2003-06-24, 2:19 pm |
| quote:
What about the entry level IT professional??
My first attempt at an IT job was to try and get one of the low-ranking positions in the IT dept. at the place I worked.
The first development position I got was obtained through the employment service at the tech school I attended. It didn't pay much, but it was a start.
On the subject of experience, note that it is usually paid work experience that employers want, not volunteer or hobby work.
RD | |
| ClintonN 2003-06-24, 2:46 pm |
| You're right about paid experience. However it gets you some recognition in your area. Let's say you do some volunteer work for church or school. You do a good job and someone takes notice. Then someone in conversation says they need a new employee to the person you've done volunteer work. That might give you a foot in the door. Who you know is very important no matter what industry your in. Also the hands on never hurts. | |
| Bingram 2003-06-24, 9:50 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by BigC2004
What about the entry level IT professional?? Where are the jobs for those individuals?? There are none. That is what we are talking about here. Not employment for someone who has 10 years of experience, or 50 IT certs.
My definition of "entry level IT" -- Bench tech, cable installer, general PC repair, help desk level 1, or call support. Are those jobs out there? Bet your sweet 4th point of contact they are, and in every job market.
What do they pay? $7 to $10.
Is it fair to ask an MCSE looking for an "entry level IT" job to do some bench tech time at $7 to $10? Well you have to start somewhere.
Now if we want to talk mid level or higher level IT jobs, I'd say the markets vary with region. But there are still openings at those levels, you just have to be flexible. | |
| Teck Shark 2003-06-25, 9:54 am |
| Don't forget that many companies, both big & small, prefer to hire internally as well. The last 15 out of 18 jobs that my company has posted were filled internally. So they never made it to the outside world.
But many other things contribute to success at finding a job. A well written resume/cv, good interviewing skills, your appearance, your professionalism, writing & speaking skills, problem solving skills, etc. The list goes on. Not to mention that with all the unemployment right now, companies can afford to be very picky when chosing candidates. It's definitely an employers' market. | |
| onoski 2003-06-25, 10:22 am |
| Originally posted by Teck Shark
Don't forget that many companies, both big & small, prefer to hire internally as well. The last 15 out of 18 jobs that my company has posted were filled internally. So they never made it to the outside world.
But many other things contribute to success at finding a job. A well written resume/cv, good interviewing skills, your appearance, your professionalism, writing & speaking skills, problem solving skills, etc. The list goes on. Not to mention that with all the unemployment right now, companies can afford to be very picky when chosing candidates. It's definitely an employers' market.
This is what gets to me with employers being hypocrites advertising a job that has already being filled internally only for HR references. What goes around comes around its only time before the market swings back to normal. Thanks for the intelligent and useful contributions to this thread guys/gals IT is here to stay so am I cos ain't giving up even in these depressing times what about you? The choice is yours, remember though nothings easy in life it's but a struggle and persistent that wins the day. Cheerio and study wisely, best wishes all. | |
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