Certifications and IT jobs/Salaries

Author

MCSE status

cassie

2001-10-25, 6:22 am

All,

I have been hearing about people who are really cheesed off that the MCSE on NT4 is going to remain a valid certification for the time being.

This sounds to me like an interesting topic for debate.

What do you think of the following views (not necessarily my own!!!):

1. IT professionals should expect to have to upgrade their skills and certs regularly therefore they should do so with good cheer and MCSEs on NT4 should be de-certified.

2. It is still valuable for employers to identify people with either NT4 or Win2K skills therefore it is good for both MCSE certifications to be valid.

Would be interested to hear what you all think!

Cassie

eheinz

2001-10-25, 1:52 pm

Hi Cassie!
You know, I don't have a problem upgrading and keeping up with the market. The problem I have is with Microsoft "decertifying" those of us who have a specific knowledge. My previous employer is still using Win95 and NT 4.0. The only people who had W2K were System Admins and the Web Development group. My new company uses Win98 and NT also.

My goal was to upgrade my NT MCP to W2K then pursue SQL 7.0. Well, guess what? Now MS is going to phase out 7.0 for SQL 2K. Again, not an issue, but the problem arises in the fact that MS won't allow both certs to continue even when the IT market is NOT going to go to 2K as quickly.

I think they should allow a cert to continue....why not let people still cert in NT or SQL 7.0? If the issue is the difficulty of the tests, then make the tests more reflective of the product (i.e. harder, I guess). What about the IT bloke who isn't NT certified, but only has NT in their infrastructure? Why not let them coexist?

Don't get me wrong, I'm an MS guy, always have been, but I'm not using 2K products right now - and by the time my company gets there, we'll be on to something else. Yes, I can do it on my own, but that's not quite the same, is it?

My wish is that MS would continue to recognize the titles (MSCE NT, etc.), they should overlap and offer certs parallel longer when they want to phase them out, and though they try to force the market to upgrade, they should listen to the market as well.

Thanks,

Nicole

2001-10-25, 1:52 pm

My $.02:

I manage an NT 4.0 network with absolutely no plans to make Bill richer any time soon. Why on earth would I want to hire a new Win 2k MCSE?

I think tying certifications to versions is a good thing. As the NT 4.0 cert ages, it's market value will decrease, which is fine. If I still have a 4.0 network in 2004 and I get an application by someone who still hasn't bothered to upgrade their cert... well, then I'd be worried. But if it shows that s/he was certified in NT 4.0/2000/.NET/etc. -- I'd be more impressed that they had been in the business for a long time, knew their way around, and had a commitment to continued learning. As opposed to the "paper cert" that just crammed for the latest exam.

This is especially valid in many environments where you have mixed platforms and versions.

Kasor

2001-10-25, 4:58 pm

It doesn't matter, soon or later NT 4.0 will run out of service(in general) and Win2000 or XP will take over!

Time will be there enemgy!

johndavies

2001-10-28, 9:24 pm

I recently went to a Dell marketing conference and when one of the speakers asked who had upgraded their networks to Win2K, only 4 people raised their hands out of about 25 people. The rest were still on NT4. Regardless of their reasons for remaining with WinNT4.0, there is still a great deal of support needed for the 4.0 platform.

hendraep

2001-11-01, 2:20 am

hi again cassie
thanks to you

My friend is mcse win nt, and he was really happy to heard that mcse win nt will not de- certified. But the problem is he is not trying to upgrade his skill. Since he alredy got a great job, he is not interested anymore in taking any exams as long his career still safe and his employer happy

So in my opinion everybody should upgrade his skill, but considering that one certification is still valid just for 2-3 year, i think maybe we're just a slave for some vendor.

chodan

2001-11-02, 7:38 pm

I was relieved to hear Microsoft`s plan to not decertify.
I am pursueing the 2000 track still "1 test left" because when looking at someones resume that has MCSE on windows NT4 and 2000 you can give the impression of being an industry veteran and also someone who is keeping current.An employer who sees that sees expeirience, which we all know is the true king of the IT job market.
Chodan

Tekmazter

2001-11-11, 3:50 pm

One thing I haven't heard anyone say about this is...Do you really think M-Soft was EVER going to expire current MCSE's? Wouldn't it make more sense or cents depending on how you look at it, if M-Soft was ploying to make money off of previous MCSE's by telling them all that their certs would expire? They would get the most out of all of those who previously cert'd and didn't want to have to go through all the testing again. Then, right before everyone's cert's expire...M-Soft comes out and says...naaa, we won't expire you afterall. Hmmm, now that all of the previous NT MCSE's have taken oh, let's say 5 more exams, the mindset will be, well I only have two more left so I might as well finish my 2000. Makes you think doesn't it?

Benoit

2001-11-20, 6:53 pm

Just tie the MCSE to versions.

'nuff said.

BillR

2001-11-23, 8:10 am

I had a different view of the subject. I thought that with the "de-certification" of NT4, I would have less competition for jobs as a "valid" MCSE. 5 tests into the process, I hear that NT4 is going to remain a valid certification, hence no drop in the number of certified people.
In all honesty, the branch of the company I work for is still using NT4. (they're ALSO still using a 56K leased line for a WAN connection, but that's another story!

)
I feel the the NT4 folks have a big advantage now, since they can have 2 valid certifications. As far as I know, I could not get certified on NT4 right now. If this is not the case, please let me know...
OK, I'm done wining!

eheinz

2001-11-25, 9:34 pm

That goes along with my point, the "Title" for MCSE in NT will not De-certify, but you can no longer take the tests. And, according to an article in MCP Mag, MS has discontued further sale of the NT 4 product (no surprise), they also did this with the Office 2K products prior to XP's release. This has become common business: force users to upgrade to continue to generate revenue. however, my personal opinion is MS should still allow certification in NT until it is absolutely no longer viable. Hell, I know (used to work for) a huge book superstore chain who was still using 3.1 up until this year!!! So don't tell me it's no longer relevent. It's too darn expensive for business to upgrade just because the new thing is on the market.
As for changing their stance, since they still discontinued the tests, the only thing they have allowed is for NT certs to remain "active" by virtue of allowing you to use the title, which I presume most of us would still have done anyway.

Nothing should surprise anyone anymore.

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