Linux/Unix - Observation

Author

Observation

Mr. Linux Guy

2002-11-23, 9:35 pm

This is directed mainly at new Linux/UNIX users. I recently installed Red Hat 7.3 on one of my web servers (I do not yet trust RH 8.0 enough to do this on priduction servers). I chose the text mode install. When I installed RH 7.3 I noticed that there were several 'options' available. One was 'Workstation', another was 'server' (I may have the details wrong, but I am sure they are right in general detail). The 'server' install led to another screen which allowed one to choose what type of server one would like to install . . . batadase, web, mail, etc. I chose 'web' for my web servers (imagine that!). One thing that I noticed at once was the much more logical partitioning scheme and much, much fewer amount of packages that were installed by default.

I would suggest that this would be a great way of learning Linux for newbies. For one thing, instead of having every application known or used added to the workstation app deck, and having a partitioning scheme that was not that obvious, I found that rather than being more difficult, it was cautally much simpler. There were many fewer packages to deal with, and the partitions were much more meaningful. I also refused to install X and thus was forced to do all via the command line. This would also be of much use to the newcomer, as one would be forced to deo all via the CLI rather than depending on a fiendly interface.

As I found apps that I did not want or did not plan on using, I uninstalled them as I regarded them as security risks (typical Randy there).

If newcomers adopted this approach, they would have an easier time, I think, understanding partitioning that the dreadful "dual-booting" scenario, and they would learn Linux via command line and only later install the uneeded GUI if they desired. This would give them the flexibility of moving from almost any flavour of UNIX to any other with little effort as well as giving them 'command' of the command line. As Linux is usually used as a server anyway, it would give them a heads-up on the use of Linux as a server ratehr than a workstation (or 'playstation') as it is rarely used for in corporate environments.

Filesystem and 'hacking', I think, would come easier as well. It's just a thought but may be of use to those interested.

onoski

2002-11-24, 6:50 am

Thanks for the insight Randy

as I'd be trying your suggestion tonite on my Linux 7.3 box. Yep! you're right CLI is the way to go for newbies a little steep at first but should brighten up with practicing. Cheerio and keep the knowledge base flowing as knowledge is power.

TW2001

2002-11-25, 12:01 pm

I complete agree...thats the way I learned. Learing Linux is not navigating a desktop.

I also would add learning vi (or one of the other editors..this one is usually on every *nix box...is essential. If you cant properly edit files...well your kind of stuck.

Mr. Linux Guy

2002-11-25, 12:27 pm

quote:
Originally posted by TW2001
I complete agree...thats the way I learned. Learing Linux is not navigating a desktop.

I also would add learning vi (or one of the other editors..this one is usually on every *nix box...is essential. If you cant properly edit files...well your kind of stuck.

Well, I make it a habit to uninstall all packages that either I do not use or do not like . . . and the only editor I ever use is 'vi' so I'm pretty safe on that score! But you are right. No matter which is your favourite, you need to know it to be able to navigate and edit config files in UNIX properly. Emacs is too darn big to be of much use in a crisis (although its great if you're a programmer).

drdirt

2002-11-30, 1:24 am

Now I see why I'm using my "server" for all my development!

Really, you could install any server option and get the advantage Mr. Randy Guy (ooo, that doesn't sound as nice as all that...) talks about. If you are really noob - and MS oriented, you will be surprised. Servers in Linux have alot less stuff in them.

If you are used to CLI, okay, but if not - you will not be a disgrace and a tech-failure to use a gui for somethings.

Noobs like me should not be intimidated or confused by these X-treme Linux Hardcores! Even hardcores like these three are using x windows while surfing this forum.

I like having a workstation with x around for formal correspondence, CAD drafting, report writing, and surfing. My wife used to refuse to CLI, so her machine always booted to x-windows and had StarOffice on the desktop (but it was Gnome on debian).

...Although cruising thru usenets is much faster w/o all the gui overhead.

Would'nt you hardcores suggest that a newbie get used to dependencies before doing package uninstalls?

drdirt, moderate user

I've hosed up enough boxes to take things in lil' bitty steps...and I am okay with that.

Mr. Linux Guy

2002-11-30, 6:29 am

You are missing part of my point. If you are a newbie, one of the ways to get used to the idea of dependencies is by doing package installs/uninstalls. And no, you won't be a tech failure if you use X, but if you aren't forced to use the CLI as much as posible at first, then you will be mising a great deal of the flexibility of this tool. The point was that if you *aren't* used to the CLI but want to get to know it, there is no better way than this.

And I wasn't suggesting that you do this for normal workstation use, but as a learning tool.

BTW, you do not need to run X to see or post in these forums, although they are prettier if you do.

drdirt

2002-11-30, 2:54 pm

thanks

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