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Home > Archive > CCNP > April 2001 > CCIE laid off?
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| jane55 2001-04-16, 5:52 am |
| A friend sent me this email. Could this be real?
What do you think about the market these days? I am asking bcoz I live
nearby to "Motorola" and they've laid off 25 CCIEs last month and 7 CCIEs this
month.....you might not beleive this but I am pretty sure they are CCIEs. So,
its kindda scary these days. | |
| dmaftei 2001-04-16, 6:01 am |
| quote:
Originally posted by jane55
A friend sent me this email. Could this be real?
A scam. | |
| unbelievable 2001-04-16, 7:34 am |
| CCIEs are in hot demand up here in Igloo city. I know because we (my company) are seeking for a couple right now...
...definitely not true!! | |
| Detour 2001-04-16, 8:26 am |
| I guess it's possible. When you're looking to trim the fat, cutting CCIE's high salaries is tempting to execs. There's a large number of companies out there that would snatch them up though. I'm just surprised to see 32 CCIE's at one company. Even Motorola. Maybe I'm just out of touch with the larger companies, but at a Fortune 500 company I once contracted for they didn't even have 1. Then again, in the IT industry I meet so many IT guys that 1) lie about what they make 2) lie about their certs | |
| Jamesbond_007 2001-04-16, 10:40 am |
| You never know it can be possible. I have been following what is happening to Motorola lately and they are trimming a lot of people because they are losing money. Last I check they where looking a cut 3000 plus jobs. They are not the only ones that are laying off people. Lucent,LG3, Ericson and others are laying off a lot of people. Just because you have a CCIE doesn't mean your company will never lay you off. If a company is trying to stay afloat, they will do what they have to to stay alive. Look at it this way. You have a company that is in the red and needs to cut back on spending. The CFO starts to look at where to trim the fat. He looks at the where the highest spending is happening, and IT is by far a large part of it. The CFO looks at the highest salaries and looks at cutting back. The CFO doesn't know how valuable the CCIE's are, he only thinks someone else can do their job and pay them less for it. So he lays the CCIES off. I bet there are a lot of CCIE's that have been layed off one time or another. It doesn't mean they don't get another job right away. Because they are in demand another company would pick them up right away. So it is totaly possible. | |
| dmaftei 2001-04-16, 11:47 am |
| quote:
Originally posted by Jamesbond_007
The CFO looks at the highest salaries and looks at cutting back. The CFO doesn't know how valuable the CCIE's are, he only thinks someone else can do their job and pay them less for it. So he lays the CCIES off.
If that's the case, the CFO should be fired! [grin] | |
| Jamesbond_007 2001-04-16, 12:00 pm |
| it comes down to ego's. CFO and upper management think they can get anyone to do any job. I just quit a company because the VP of the company thought he would tell us how to do our job and felt like he could do it better than us. He has been a doctor his whole life and just started a company in technology. He felt he knew best in setting up networks, firewalls, and web servers and tried to tell us we where doing things wrong. I got so frustrated because he wanted things done his way and the network was failing apart. But is whole attitude was anybody can do our job. I have found this attitude in upper management a lot. | |
| dmaftei 2001-04-18, 8:34 am |
| It certainly can happen. But when and where it does happen, it reveals upper management's stupidity. This reminds me of a joke. When God created the man, he assigned a fixed amount of intelligence to humankind. And the population keeps growing... I suppose our hypothetical CFO and your real VP prove this joke has some roots in reality.
Cheers! | |
| kk1186 2001-04-18, 9:12 am |
| This joke is happening in every large corporation. My company's I.S. department has many managers, senior managers and directors. They don't even know why we use switches rather than hubs. Whenever there is any layoff action the most knowledgable and technically sound will be the first one to be laid off. Those stupid managers are still alive. | |
| darthfeces 2001-04-18, 9:40 am |
| don't sweat it
if you happen to be a ccie worth half
your weight companies will grovel to
receive their services. | |
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| ....Hey are you guys aware of the fact that there are just roughly 3000 CCIE's in the US, and roughly 5000 on the face of this earth ???....that story just can't be true! --- Be happy if you ever get to meet a CCIE in person! :-) | |
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| comblues 2001-04-25, 5:14 pm |
| It seems to me that I recall hearing of a company in the Northeast (not motorola) boasting of over 70 CCIE's on staff and having one of the largest, if not the largest, CCIE population outside of Cisco.
Now how many does Motorola have?
Cisco is said to employ well over 1000 of those inside the U.S. (Hearsay)
And quite a few are renowned for their books or bootcamps or other ventures.
Finally each state has a few freelanancers who are said to charge as much as $10k per day on contract.
Yes, I know of a gentleman commanding 7-10k per day. But then he is being contracted by huge International Banks and such.
Now, Cisco also has a number of Silver and Gold Partners, and I do recall a certain chart on Cisco's site citing that another CCIE is "required" per $40,000,000 (forty million) dollars worth of sales by that partner in order to retain that status and priveleges that are given for that level of commitment.
Now back to the question.
How many CCIE's does motorola have.
I've been through groupstudy's forum on many an occassion and rarely if ever even once remember seeing asingle CCIE or CCIE-to-be with motorola (but then my memory may be less than photographic).
However it is better than the norm, but statistically I would have to remember at least seeing it, I guess the Motorola CCIE's are introverted and don't come out much except when fired.
I think the number sounds excessive, but not impossible.
I do find it hard to believe that anyone is leting go of that much talent without a fight.
ciao | |
| doctorcisco 2001-04-26, 8:41 am |
| I have no idea how many CCIE's Motorola had/has on staff. I really would be surprised that they had 70 on staff, unless they were telecommunications AND networking gurus working on cellular communications design or something like that. Just BTW, Motorola's layoff numbers are more like 10,000 since 1/1. (Their HQ is about 20 miles from my house. Guess who's competing with all those bodies out in the job search world!  )
However, regarding the numbers ... it's helpful, I think, to remember that many Fortune 500 companies don't have any CCIE's on staff because many (most?) outsource their computer network design and management. The firms who receive the outsourcing contracts are the ones who would be hiring the CCIE types. If there's a firm in the Northeast with 70, they probably do consulting, design, and/or network management for literally hundreds of firms, with several "big fish" clients.
The company I work for (for a few more weeks, anyway ... they're exiting the networking business) did just that. At one time, we had a dozen CCIE's in our engineering department. As for work ... we had full-time management of about 40 WAN's (1 Fortune 50, 1 very big foreign car maker's U.S. network, several other big firms, some smaller ones also) totalling around 7000 sites, and I know the engineering folks did consulting for additional companies we did not do network management for.
Our Fortune 50 client had 0 CCIE's on their payroll. They did, however, have 1 of ours assigned nearly full time as lead on an engineering team of about 6 people, 5 of whom had no other client to work on at all. That way, the senior engineers (i.e. the CCIE's) only got the truly thorny/difficult problems to deal with.
FWIW,
doctorcisco |
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