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Home > Archive > CCNA > March 2004 > Failed Again
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| Joe Dali 2004-02-25, 10:20 pm |
| Well i didn't know what show frame-relay map? would show out of 6 options ... I'm so bummed ... same crap, same trick questions ... I give up. | |
| Boulware5 2004-02-25, 10:38 pm |
| We just covered frame-relay map the other week in my class. You use it to map an interface or subinterface to a DLCI number. | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-25, 10:44 pm |
| I didn't phrase the question correctly, it was 6 possible outcomes of doing a frame-relay? comamnd.
Yes, I know what frame relay map does.
Just not what a show frame-relay? will display as possible options.
Simple ... but I didn't have show frame relay? memorized, lol. Who cares. | |
| Boulware5 2004-02-25, 10:53 pm |
| They expect you to know what shows after a "command?" ?! | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-25, 10:57 pm |
| Save your $$$ - screw this test.
I have over 10 years ecperience in this industry, can sit down at any router, switch and do anything I need to do.
Its idiotic to ask such obtuse lame questions. And I'm not just talking about the show frame-relay? command.
So many lame questions ... it inspires one to resort to cheating. Because Odom's book doesn't get this deep. Forget about Lammle. | |
| Boulware5 2004-02-25, 10:58 pm |
| Anyone agree with what he is saying? I won't take it for a while, but I'm already getting very discouraged after reading this.  | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-25, 11:03 pm |
| I'm discouraged too, what can I say? I have a 3640 and a 1900 on my desk, Boson, study guides, Odom, Lammle, experience. What more do I need? I dunno anymore ... its a rediculous test in my opinion.
Testing Knowledge -VS- Playing Games
Cisco plays games.
Better to test knowledge. | |
| Boulware5 2004-02-25, 11:09 pm |
| Did you come close to passing or did you totally bomb it? | |
| steeda 2004-02-25, 11:57 pm |
| Instead of getting angry, log into your 3640, configure an interface with frame encapsulation, and experiment with the show commands.
If you failed, it was from more than just not knowing this particular area. What else did you not seem to get, or find to be "games"?
PS: I want to help, but 1st you need to cool off and objectively think of where you were weak. | |
| scooter 2004-02-26, 4:20 am |
| I'm a ways off from taking my test, but I too am starting to get discouraged by what I'm hearing from recent test takers. In my Cisco Academy class, we continually run into questions in the class that just makes everyone, including the teacher of the class, scratch their head and wonder. It either seems like a deliberate attempt to not only confuse, but to 'trick' for lack of a better word, the person answering the question. I don't know...I'm still going to forge ahead, but I hope to start hearing some more positive reviews.
Joe Dali - simply don't quit now. | |
| nethead 2004-02-26, 7:10 am |
| I don't think knowing the output of commands should be too much of a problem if you have access to a router.
What I tend to try and do is have a visual image in my mind of the commands which have more output to them. Perhaps it would help to make a list of the commands that can come up for each topic and what kind of output each one has.
If you have experience with Cisco kit and work with the stuff then knowing output from commands shouldn't be a problem.
Also sometimes during an exam I find there are questions where I have to work out the answer by a process of elimination - ie. what cannot be the answer, and find this helps.
Look on your printout from the exams and look at what are your weak points on the percentages given and then concentrate on these for the next time. | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-26, 8:41 am |
| I realize now how easy that one was ... its not just that one, and I'm not saying that particular one was tough.
The one about adding a static route so people could reach the net had ONE correct answer and 4 bogus ones ABOUT RIP!!!
I tried hitting comment saying nice try and moving on, but it wanted another answer.
So soopit. Why such blatant idiocy?
In the real world stuff like this doesn't happen.
Cisco still sux.
I'm starting to believe cheating is the only way to manuever around the trickery.
Maybe the Cheet guides advertised here are the only way.
I repeat, Odom and Lammle will NOT prepare you for the tough ones. Sad but trooooo.
$250 wasted, thanx Cisco. | |
| worrywarm 2004-02-26, 11:11 am |
| sorry to hear that...
I don't really know what to say, because for one thing, the question you post I have no clue at all. This possibly is one of those no-correct-answer question, isn't it?
Just too tricky
any conclusion from this experience? any plan to retake? Again, don't give up! | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-26, 11:33 am |
| I won't give up ... I'll try the 2 exam route. | |
| worrywarm 2004-02-26, 11:38 am |
| Joe, can you tell me about the exact test process on the pc?
For instance, first you will go through some instruction. Then, the questions comes. One at a time. If you recognize it is one of those bogus questions, what should you do? At any time, you cannot go back, right?
Finally you got a printout of your questions and answers? will it show your wrong answers and the should-be answers?
Any other things I should be aware of before taking the test?
THanks!! | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-26, 11:48 am |
| The testing center in San Jose can't print out the reports so you ahve to call Prometric.
The sheet simply says pass or fail, nothing specific question-wise. Just % for the different areas.
Memo to those studyign for this. you need to be so over preapred its sickening. Memorize every question on celticrover, memorize every foundation summary point in Odom, memorize every study guide question and answer, be able to subnet in yer head.
Whats really hilarious is I have a friend who passed the old CCNA and he just got a job for $40/hr doing PIX installs downtown at a finance comapny.
So he calls me on wednesday and in a panic unable to configure the router. He brought nothing to prepare, no configs nothing. So as I was talking to him over the phone I go to siliconvalleyccie.com and walk him thorough the configuration. I had to explain to him the difference between the private and public interface, he wasn't getting it. And hes a CCNA. I'm not. Something is disturbingly wrong here gentleman. $40/hr ... lol ... 
So, I say to all of you with a non-801 CCNA, I respect you, but have a ton of more respect for this new test. Its a different animal, trust me. Go take it and see if you pass. | |
| popdevil 2004-02-26, 12:21 pm |
| I've seen many MCSE's that would come to me with simple questions and I knew they were PAPER MCSE's. I guess the same would go for the CCNA's.
I would re-read the books again, take the test exams many many times over. Good luck!
I haven't taken the test but I'm going to plan on taking it no matter what. | |
| npo3po 2004-02-26, 1:44 pm |
| Well i took the ccna 640-801 and failed, a couple of weeks ago, i literally felt sick, like i wanted to throw up, after leaving the test, i mean i studied hardcore for a month and half, dropping everthing else, when i saw the questions on that test it was immediately clear i had no chance in hell of passing it, and i didn't even want to take it again, but i'm several weeks removed from that, and plan to take it again, because my philosophy is i already learned so much why should i let it go to waste, i realized in was in a very good position to focus in on the details, and notice the little differences in things, that i wouldn't have noticed studying for the first around, when you're just trying to figure out what everything means. By the way guys i'm using how2pass.com in addition to celtic rover, and the lammle book, but i'd say once you know your stuff, just do questions and focus on what different commands would show you, also i've come across that same "what does show-frame relay display" question on how2pass.
Good luck to all, and don't give it up, cause i won't.
Amir | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-26, 1:50 pm |
| Yer right Amir ... I didn't mean to over blow the Frame Relay? question, how easy is that ... and, in both Odom and Lammle they go over them, so that one was my fault, I was just pist that I could not recognize the right ones right off the bat. Pisser. I will not let this test or the CCNA defeat me. I think i'll join how 2 pass too. | |
| worrywarm 2004-02-26, 2:18 pm |
| Amir, did you purchase the practice questions from how2pass or just go over the forums? | |
| npo3po 2004-02-26, 4:21 pm |
| i bought the 60day 640-801 subscription, for $39 bucks. Also about 3 days ago i got a hold of a 640-801 actualtests.com practice exams(2/10/04 version), through a friend, by chance. | |
| worrywarm 2004-02-26, 4:28 pm |
| Too expensive... | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-26, 4:39 pm |
| Good luck to all studying ... if you want tips from someone whos seen it all on 801, holla ... :] | |
| ZacDogg 2004-02-26, 7:53 pm |
| Why not look at how tough the test is as a positive? After a while the certification will again get the reputation of one that actually means something. I know it is tough now, but believe me, in a few years you will look back and see how easy it really was and how much you've learned since then.
Zac | |
| npo3po 2004-02-27, 12:15 am |
| ZacDogg, that definitely true, i'm more concerned about job availability, there may be an increase in a cert's value, but jobs could still be going to india, china, or where ever it may be cost effective to do so, but i'm not putting all my eggs in 1 basket(i.e certs), that's why i'll also be hunting down my computer enigeering degree, and hopelly someday i'll be a ccie myself. | |
| Kitsune 2004-02-27, 3:32 am |
| Joe, when I came here after failing for the second time, you were the first to answer my questions. They say the 3rd time is a charm, and it was for me: I passed today. I don't know how many times you have taken it, but it is passable. Maybe Cisco requires a minimum investment? (Cisco press book plus multiple exams?)
Anyway, this post is just a "you can do it!".  | |
| Mitch1301 2004-02-27, 10:56 am |
| quote:
Originally posted by ZacDogg
Why not look at how tough the test is as a positive? After a while the certification will again get the reputation of one that actually means something. I know it is tough now, but believe me, in a few years you will look back and see how easy it really was and how much you've learned since then.
Zac
I don’t agree, with the test getting more difficult everyone will flock to the dump sites. There is no way to make a cert gain a positive reputation unless they take the route RHCE has taken, you have to sit a hands on portion and score 80% or better to pass. Just my opinion.
later
Mitch | |
| smrkdown 2004-02-27, 12:11 pm |
| The more difficult the test the less "dump sites" will help since the questions become more granular and the lab simulations require a more demanding understanding of the material. | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-27, 7:40 pm |
| Well guys as an example of how nearly nothing but Cisco itself can possibly prepare you for stuff unexpected, here is the data on the question that I missed.
This whole page was required reading for the last question on my 2nd attempt at the CCNA.
Obviously, a CCNP or someone with real experience could have known this. I did not. Its not in Odom, Cisco Flash cards or Lammle.
It is on CelticRover though. So, I guess you really need to understand every little subject from all of these sources.
Here is what I missed:
http://www.cisco.com/warp/public/105/default.html | |
| Joe Dali 2004-02-27, 8:35 pm |
| I find it disturbing that as an MCSE who has configured small office routers and access to the Internet that I did not know about this command. Am I paper?
Configuring Summary and Default Routes
In many situations, it is undesirable to carry the entire routing table for an intranet or for the Internet. These situations include a small office with a single connection to the corporate intranet, a router that is configured with insufficient memory, or a single connection to a single ISP. In these situations, end users want to reach certain destination addresses that are not specifically found in the routing table.
Under normal circumstances, these packets would be discarded as unreachable destinations. However, through the use of summary routes and default network routes, a router can still have reachability information. A summary route and a default route both provide alternative path information when no route specifically matches a destination IP address.
A summary route provides default reachability information within a given address space. The summary route, which normally follows classful network boundaries, is typically used to provide default reachability information about subnets that are not specifically found in the routing table but that exist within the intranet.
In the ZIP network, for example, the route 131.108.0.0/16 would be considered a summary route. If a router in the ZIP network encounters a packet destined to 131.108.99.5 but does not find a specific route—such as 131.108.99.0/24—it usually discards the packet. If in this situation there were a summary route 131.108.0.0/16 in the routing table, the packet would be forwarded out the interface toward the next-hop destination for the summary route.
The summary route usually points to another subnet route within the intranet, but it can also point to a specific next-hop IP address. In either case, the goal of the summary route is to direct packets toward other routers within the intranet that have more complete routing information.
The summary route can be configured using the IOS global configuration commands ip default-network or ip route.
When using the ip default-network command, a nonconnected subnet that exists within the intranet is supplied as a parameter to the command. When the ip route command is used, the summary route, the network mask, and the nonconnected subnet are supplied as parameters. The following are examples of both commands as configured on the ZIP Singapore router. In these examples, the summary route is 131.108.0.0/16, and the nonconnected subnet used for default reachability is 131.108.20.0, which is found on the SF-Core-1 and SF-Core-2 routers:
Singapore#configure
Configuring from terminal, memory, or network [terminal]?
Enter configuration commands, one per line. End with CNTL/Z.
Singapore(config)#ip default-network 131.108.20.0
Singapore(config)#^Z
When an IP station is communicating with another company, university, or other entity—either through private network connections or via the Internet—it sends packets that need to reach stations residing in an IP address space other than its own. For example, if a station in the ZIP network is communicating with the popular web site www.yahoo.com, packets originating from the ZIP network address space of 131.108.0.0/16 are destined for Yahoo!'s network address space of 216.32.74.55/22. To forward packets properly, the ZIP network routers need either a route to 216.32.74.55/22 or a less-specific CIDR route giving them the general direction of the Yahoo! network.
As explained earlier, it is unlikely that every router in the ZIP network or even the ZIP Internet connection router has this route in its routing tables. Unless the ZIP network has multiple ISPs or is exchanging dynamic routing information with its sole ISP, the ZIP network routers probably rely on a default network route to provide reachability information for the Yahoo! site, as well as for other sites on the Internet (or potentially within their own intranet).
The basic concept of the default route is that when a router does not have specific routing information for a destination, it will use the default path to a specified network where there are routers with more complete information. Although the default route is similar to the summary route, it is used to direct packets to IP destinations that are outside both the autonomous intranet and the classful address boundaries for a given entity. In the case of the Internet, a company's ISP or the ISP's upstream provider is likely exchanging dynamic routing information with other ISPs about the location and reachability of all networks on the Internet. Using an IP network address in the ISP's network as a default route, a company's Internet connection router forwards packets to unknown destinations toward the ISP and ultimately to routers with more complete routing tables and pictures of the Internet.
We will now discuss some of the many methods for configuring a default network using the IOS software:
Configuring a default network using a dynamic learned external route
Configuring a default network using a statically configured external route
Configuring a default network using the reserved address 0.0.0.0
The primary difference between methods of configuring a default network is whether any dynamic routing information is learned from an external source, such as an ISP. When routes to external network addresses are learned from an external source, simply denote one of these external addresses as the default network by using the IOS global configuration command ip default-network. The parameter to this command is a route that has the following characteristics: It exists in the routing table, it is not connected to the router being configured, and it falls outside the classful address space configured on any of the router's interfaces. The following is an example of configuring theip default-network command on the ZIP SF-Core-1 router to the network 140.222.0.0, which is being learned from the ZIP network's ISP:
SF-Core-1#configure
Configuring from terminal, memory, or network [terminal]?
Enter configuration commands, one per line. End with CNTL/Z.
SF-Core-1(config)#ip default-network 140.222.0.0
SF-Core-1(config)#^Z
After it is configured, the router shows that it has accepted this network as a default and that the route is reachable by signifying it as the gateway of last resort in the output of show ip route. The router places an asterisk next to the route to denote that the route is a candidate for the default network because multiple defaults may be configured. The following is an example of the gateway of last resort set on the ZIP SF-Core-1 router:
SF-Core-1#show ip route
Codes: C - connected, S - static, I - IGRP, R - RIP, M - mobile, B - BGP
D - EIGRP, EX - EIGRP external, O - OSPF, IA - OSPF inter area
N1 - OSPF NSSA external type 1, N2 - OSPF NSSA external type 2
E1 - OSPF external type 1, E2 - OSPF external type 2, E - EGP
i - IS-IS, L1 - IS-IS level-1, L2 - IS-IS level-2, * - candidate default
U - per-user static route, o - ODR
Gateway of last resort is 192.72.2.1 to network 140.222.0.0
131.108.0.0/16 is variably subnetted, 5 subnets, 3 masks
C 131.108.20.0/22 is directly connected, FastEthernet0/0
C 131.108.240.0/30 is directly connected, Serial1/0
S 131.108.230.0/24 [1/0] via 131.108.240.2
S 131.108.231.0/24 [1/0] via 131.108.100.0
S 131.108.232.0/24 [1/0] is directly connected,
FastEthernet0/0
C 192.7.2.2/30 is directly connected, Serial1/1
B* 140.222.0.0/16 [20/19] via 192.7.2.1, 3d08h
When dynamic routing is not exchanged with your external provider, it is possible to use a static route to point to the external network address that is used as a default. The following is the previous example again, but this time a static route is used to provide reachability information about the default network address through the ISP connection:
SF-Core-1#configure
Configuring from terminal, memory, or network [terminal]?
Enter configuration commands, one per line. End with CNTL/Z.
SF-Core-1(config)#ip route 140.222.0.0 255.255.0.0 192.7.2.1
SF-Core-1(config)#ip default-network 140.222.0.0
SF-Core-1(config)#^Z | |
| luisjo 2004-02-28, 10:16 am |
| man, i think your judging your self to hard, it prooves that you really know your stuff, sometimes when we take a test we get a lot of load over our shoulders.
Easy up on your self, reorganize your study material, or better start studing another cert a easy one, like net+ some cert that when you pass boost your confidence, then get the start studing for the ccna.
good luck
Luisjo | |
| Wilieco 2004-02-29, 4:36 pm |
| Hey Guy. Don't get so down on yourself. I know the sickening feeling. I failed the 640-607 twice and then took the new 640-801 and passed what a sweet feeling. I waited a year before I took it the second time. BIG mistake. I studied my butt off for 3 months and took it again. So Sweet. To you guys thinking of taking it I think the new test is mostly subnetting wildcard masks and a lot of access-list stuff you gotta know this stuff inside out and be able to do it fast or the time will kill you. I think the knew test has less trick questions but time was my mortal enemy. Just don't give up. Blow off some steam and then hit it again. | |
|
| ahhahahahah
im sure we can all sit on a switch or router
and type command ? all day and then eventually work out it
but if you know commands off the top of your head you turn into elite dude. lol
i only started studying for it, and will hope to sit the exam in a months time. | |
| flyersix 2004-03-01, 9:14 am |
| Sorry to hear about the problems you've been having with this test. I took the test about 4 months back and passed it.
I have an old Cisco 4000 router to run samples on. But the biggest help I found was Sybex CCNA Virtual Lab Gold. The software came bundled with the study book for the test and walked you through a number of scenarios found on the test. You don't need any routers the software simulates it all (believe it was 4 routers, 2 switches, a hub, and a number of workstations located in different networks.
I found it was worth the investment. Hope it helps. |
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