| Author |
does anyone put brain bench certs on there resume?
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| chodan 2002-02-24, 9:56 am |
| I have seen several resumes from people who have put brain bench certifications on there resume.
I know one manager who won`t hire someone who lists a brain bench cert on there resume because he thinks it shows poor judgement to do so.
I`m not against brain bench I just don`t think the carry any weight when serching for a job.
When comparing 2 equal resumes.
say both have associates degrees in CIS
but no real expierience.
One has an MCP and a Net+ or CCNA listed
the other has 5 brain bench certifications
listed.
Who would you hire?
I would go for the one who has invested more in his future, the MCP.
Don`t get me wrong I think BB Certs are great for evaluating yourself and the tests they write are usually dificult to pass.
I just think "online testing" is to prone to cheating.
Not to mention you can take the test everyday until you pass hehe.
Just throwing this out for discussion? | |
| Shrink 2002-02-24, 11:02 am |
| What are "Brain Bench" certifications?? | |
| darthw 2002-02-24, 11:14 am |
| Chodan,
All else being equal, even both candidates appearing to possess the same good attitude, and the ability to work well with others, I'd hire the one with the MCP and Net+ certifications. I, too, have done brainbench tests to assess my level of understanding, and they are challenging at times, but due to the negatives you've cited I consider them useless on a resume. | |
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| cross36 2002-02-24, 11:46 am |
| BrainBench. That's a site where you can take examinations for free and achieve their own forms of certificates.
Not a bad place, I have pushed it on people who want to start out without having a straight idea on what they want to achieve | |
| Supertech 2002-02-24, 3:10 pm |
| nope.
BB certs are the equiv. of a practice test. | |
| ComputerMan 2002-02-24, 3:14 pm |
| I disagree. I believe that Brainbench is a good investment. By the way, the exams are no longer free. The site now charges $99.00 for a full year of access to all their exams.
Brainbench exams are beneficial to the certification seeker as they test your knowledge of a particular area as related to your certification. They also assess your strengths and weaknesses in a given subject. I found their Checkpoint CCSA equivalent to be harder than the actual exam, and it did help prepare me better.
Also, we shouldn't forget that with all the paper certs out there, companies are now testing would-be applicants on-site! Employers use Brainbench tests to see what knowledge an applicant possesses. Don't be surprised when you fill out a job application and the Employer asks you to take an exam so they can properly assess your skills and see if you qualify for the job. These exams will fall under a different name instead of Brainbench though (even though Brainbench sponsors it), you will receive a PIN and proceed to a secured site at 123assess.
Go here and smell the roses...
http://ww4.123assess.com/testcenter...%2Fdefault.html
BE PREPARED!!! | |
| BootData 2002-02-24, 7:28 pm |
| I too had a handful of brainbench certs, but they are now expired...
So, I cant really display them on my CV anymore ... | |
| chodan 2002-02-24, 7:50 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by BootData
I too had a handful of brainbench certs, but they are now expired...
So, I cant really display them on my CV anymore ...
Wow I didn`t know that they expired!! | |
| wbafrank 2002-02-24, 7:55 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by chodan
Wow I didn`t know that they expired!!
 They used to be only valid for a year but Brainbench has now extended this validation to 3 years upon passing. | |
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| Brainbench on my resume? God no! I don't have enough room on it as it is 
I took a slew of their tests when I was bored during meetings -- gotta love my wireless laptop  | |
| Matt1999 2002-02-25, 8:21 am |
| "I know one manager who won`t hire someone who lists a brain bench cert on there resume because he thinks it shows poor judgement to do so."
I can't believe a manager would think like this. I would hate to work for this person or even with this person. I think it shows poor judgement to rule someone out solely on this. What's his reasoning? "Oh no, he put a cert on his resume that I don't like. He might show me his knowledge in other ways I don't like, too." Come on! It would be a good idea to put brainbench certs on your resume just to avoid working with people like this. | |
| Nicole 2002-02-25, 11:06 am |
| quote:
I can't believe a manager would think like this.
You'd be surprised at the reasons resumes get tossed out. You run an ad and are getting 300+ resumes a day. In an ideal world, every resume would be treated with respect and careful consideration. Unfortunately, you still have all your regular work to do. So they get weeded through with some very subjective data -- it doesn't mean the manager is a bad person, it means they have a limited amount of time to wade through the BS. And boy, is there a lot of BS!
I personally include Brainbench in the BS department. I've taken a few of their tests and they were too easy to cheat your way through. I wouldn't rule anybody out just because they had Brainbench on their resume, but I regard it as "filler," and my tolerance for wading through filler isn't very high by the time I hit the 15th or 20th resume. Too much fluff on a resume goes in the reject pile.
Maybe we should start a thread on reasons why resumes get rejected? | |
| Cobby 2002-02-25, 11:40 am |
| I think those tests are no different than going to networkdesigner or wanpros and testing there. The fact that they give their own cert still adds little to the validity of such exams.
Maybe as a benchmark but I would save that coveted space of paper for real accomplishments.
Just an opinion=)
Peace -Jay | |
| eljefe79 2002-02-25, 12:40 pm |
| I wouldn't hold the presence of a brainbench cert on a candidates resume against them, especially when looking at Level 0 techs or helpdesk. I try to look at individual candidates as just that..individuals and always validate their skills before briging them on the team.
As for Brainbench exams in general, they're worthless. I have a hard enough time accepting CompTIA certifications as "Industry Standard". I have always given heavier weight to vendor based certs because it shows that the individual has met the minimum level of competancy with a specific product...accumulating specific product knowledge.
I'd take ASE over Server+ anyday as well as an IBM cerified Hardware tech over an A+. | |
| pkupchik 2002-02-25, 7:50 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by Nicole
Maybe we should start a thread on reasons why resumes get rejected?
 Good idea!
I'm looking for work (and I know I'm not alone). What other things should I avoid to keep my resume out of the circular file? | |
| wbafrank 2002-02-25, 8:06 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by pkupchik
Good idea! I'm looking for work (and I know I'm not alone). What other things should I avoid to keep my resume out of the circular file?
If you look a past posts by Nicole you will find that she has some excellent posts concerning resumes - mostly in the General Discussion forum (just take a look). | |
| Nicole 2002-02-25, 9:19 pm |
| quote:
If you look a past posts by Nicole you will find that she has some excellent posts concerning resumes - mostly in the General Discussion forum (just take a look).
Thanks. Now if only people would stop sending me so MANY of them... I'm trying to hang on to my own job!
But for practice -- and ideas for my own resume -- I still read through as many of them as I have time for. If I'm really bored, I even try to email some of the back and tell them were not hiring. (Wish someone would do that for me when I'm job hunting.) | |
| darthw 2002-02-25, 9:36 pm |
| As for Brainbench exams in general, they're worthless. I have a hard enough time accepting CompTIA certifications as "Industry Standard". I have always given heavier weight to vendor based certs because it shows that the individual has met the minimum level of competancy with a specific product...accumulating specific product knowledge.
I'd take ASE over Server+ anyday as well as an IBM cerified Hardware tech over an A+.
I've taken the IBM stuff. I only took it for the pay increase we were offered for finishing the tests. I learned a whole lot less taking the IBM exams than I did on A+. I wouldn't put much stock in them. | |
| chodan 2002-02-25, 9:46 pm |
| If I ever reach CCIE I might just put that and leave the rest blank just to see if I get some responses hehe.
Just kidding
But really what else would I need to put except expeirience. | |
| pkupchik 2002-02-25, 9:57 pm |
| A+ is recognized -- and even required -- by enough employers that nobody could ever discredit you for having it. But most of the vendor certs show that you have taken the time to concentrate on something more specific; and thereby (theoretically) more in-depth. My guess (as I'm still relatively new to all of this) is that a general exam (A+, N+, etc.) would be likely to open more doors than something like an IBM cert, but to a company with all IBM boxes, the IBM cert might open it wider.
As for Brain Bench, I don't see how it could be taken any more seriously on a resume than the results of a Transcenders test. Just because it's online instead of on a cd doesn't make it any more legit as a test. It's far too easy to cheat for it to be anything more than a practice test (unless they make you take it in front of them). | |
| Nicole 2002-02-25, 9:59 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by pkupchik
Good idea!
I'm looking for work (and I know I'm not alone). What other things should I avoid to keep my resume out of the circular file?
Done. It's under the Jobs forum.
http://www.examnotes.net/forums/sho...?threadid=31358 | |
| aneesh_bhatia 2002-02-25, 10:02 pm |
| I would not put it on my resume. I think verndor cert, degree and experince are much more important. Since you can take these from home, I don't think they hold much value.
Cheers  | |
| SHippauf 2002-02-26, 12:18 pm |
| in replying to those that think the brainbench certs are the equivalent to cheating because you can use books and other reference material to take them. i say to that, SO WHAT!!! are those against these tests telling me that they never reference materials on the job. i feel it's important to know how and where to find the answer to a perplexing problem. How can anyone be expected to memorize all the hex addresses a piece of hardware uses. to me, that's a: memorize, take the test, and forget it immediately. which is equivalent to cramming for a test, pass it to get your paper, and not remember a thing the next day. | |
| chodan 2002-02-26, 1:05 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by SHippauf
in replying to those that think the brainbench certs are the equivalent to cheating because you can use books and other reference material to take them. i say to that, SO WHAT!!! are those against these tests telling me that they never reference materials on the job. i feel it's important to know how and where to find the answer to a perplexing problem. How can anyone be expected to memorize all the hex addresses a piece of hardware uses. to me, that's a: memorize, take the test, and forget it immediately. which is equivalent to cramming for a test, pass it to get your paper, and not remember a thing the next day.
I don`t recomend doing any of the things you suggest, except having reference material which is just a good idea, but thats not the same as cheating on a test, not even close.
Tests evaluate what you know not what you can look up during the test.
Comparing using reference material at work and using it on a test is just stupid. | |
| eric1971 2002-02-26, 1:37 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by chodan
I don`t recomend doing any of the things you suggest, except having reference material which is just a good idea, but thats not the same as cheating on a test, not even close.
Tests evaluate what you know not what you can look up during the test.
Comparing using reference material at work and using it on a test is just stupid.
I totally agree. Certification exams should test your knowledge, not your ability to look things up in a book. If you had to look up every problem while on the job, you wouldn't keep that job for very long. | |
| caseynrbq 2002-03-02, 10:04 am |
| Hey -
OK, well, I've got quite a few Brainbench certs, and while I do NOT list any of THEM on my "Professional" resume, I DO have MY RESUME listed on the Brainbench site, along with a pic & audio introduction, just in case...
Also, if I've already gone on an interview and feel that the prospective employer would be at all interested in my Brainbench certs (once I've already met with them), I sometimes send a thankyou letter including a link to my Brainbench transcript if they'd care to look at it. Thus, I am NOT listing BB certs on my "Professional" resume, but if they ask for more info about me, I can provide them with the BB info.
In this way, they can still see everything you've done, but ONLY if YOU think they would be impressed by it.
What do you think about that?
caseynrbq | |
| exar07 2002-03-02, 2:25 pm |
| Personally I think that online certs are taken for granted. They are good for testing and seeing your strengths and weaknesses but I wouldnt use it for anything else.
When I first saw brainbench I thought, cool!
But any one can take the test for some one else. Online certs are good training methods but not good for Authenticating knowledge for job purposes.
At testing Centers you have to prove yourself with an 2-ID's and take it while some one watches you.
Everything is going online for some reason?
Colleges are even do it! That is not good in my opinion, to much room for error (cheating).
The Internet continues to change the rules!!!!!!!!!!! | |
| pkupchik 2002-03-02, 2:32 pm |
| I think Casey has the right idea. They don't mean anything as a cert -- so there's no reason to put them on a resume. But why not use them to show a potential employer what you have been doing to stay current and to give them an idea of where your interests lie? | |
| chodan 2002-03-02, 9:13 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by aneesh_bhatia
I would not put it on my resume. I think verndor cert, degree and experince are much more important. Since you can take these from home, I don't think they hold much value.
Cheers
Hey it just occured to me Many people are getting there degree`s7777777777777777777777
7777]\\\\\\\
oops cat walked accross the keyboard,
as I was saying many people are getting there degrees online even taking there finals online, how is this any different than brainbench other than the the way a degree looks on a resume as compared to a brain bench Cert. | |
| Supertech 2002-03-02, 10:10 pm |
| The key word here is accreditation. | |
| odonata 2002-03-03, 11:51 am |
| I don't put them on my resume. Actually, the thought never even crossed my mind.
Like passing a practice exam on Cert21, Selftest Software, Transcender, etc. Would you put passing those exams on your resume?
I definitely don't think they are cheating (unless of course you get a friend to take the exam then claim the passing!), I see them as another source as taking some practice questions. | |
| hopfen 2005-05-28, 3:47 pm |
| Hiring software developers is different than hiring system administrators.
Certifications would be necessary for system administrations.
For software developers, I typically look for the soft skills on resume first--organization, appeal, words used--do they convey an understanding and education in software development. Academic words for software processes and methodologies are a big plus.
Second, I look for the variety of technical skills. If a person uses different skills without training, for different jobs, I assume the person is capable of learning and applying technologies. If the person is too focused on one technology or has certifications or even worse, Brainbench tests, I assume the person requires spoon-feeding and isn't able to apply knowledge--not to mention a completely wrong-headed mentality that software development is about mastering a programming language rather than a process.
Last but not least, I look for a degree in Computer Science. If the degree comes at the beginning of their career, they are a true programmer. I value degrees from big colleges over community colleges. Associate degrees go in the trash. Consideration is given to those with an engineering or science degree, especially EE, or even an art degree, if exceptional competence is shown in the resume, and if the degree is from a good school. | |
| hopfen 2005-05-28, 4:04 pm |
| Adding the following phrases and words will result in your resume being matched for every job with resume/job matching databases. Be prepared to hire a person to answer the telephone if you include these. If these things are added at the bottom of an on-line resume, I give the person bonus points for working the search engines.
--"Excellent written and verbal communication skills"
--"Required"
--"A Must"
--"A Plus"
--"Preferred" | |
| Farrell 2005-05-30, 10:33 am |
| quote:
Originally posted by chodan
I have seen several resumes from people who have put brain bench certifications on there resume.
I know one manager who won`t hire someone who lists a brain bench cert on there resume because he thinks it shows poor judgement to do so.
I`m not against brain bench I just don`t think the carry any weight when serching for a job.
When comparing 2 equal resumes.
say both have associates degrees in CIS
but no real expierience.
One has an MCP and a Net+ or CCNA listed
the other has 5 brain bench certifications
listed.
Who would you hire?
I would go for the one who has invested more in his future, the MCP.
Don`t get me wrong I think BB Certs are great for evaluating yourself and the tests they write are usually dificult to pass.
I just think "online testing" is to prone to cheating.
Not to mention you can take the test everyday until you pass hehe.
Just throwing this out for discussion?
I don't put them on my resume, but not because it is bad judgement. I have so many at this point that it would be kind of hard to list them all, and of course they are not well known.
However, I have taken some Brainbench tests that were ahrder than the real thing. And although it is possible to cheat, it is quote hard since all of the questions are timed and in some cases (such as the C or Java programming) you can't simply just search for answers.
My opinion of what most managers use as hiring critieria is not very high. You can't judge someone solely on a resume, you need to talk to them and see if they fit the job. | |
| yanqui 2005-05-30, 12:55 pm |
| I passed A+ on the first try. It took me three tries to pass the Technical Support test on Brainbench. I did not use any reference material even though Brainbench says it's okay to do so. And that technical support test WAS harder than either of the A+ exams. But the Brainbench objectives are different, and the exam is different. CompTIA measures your knowledge and skills, and Brainbench test was measuring your ability to solve the problems. I don't remember everything I learned for the A+ exam, and I don't think that CompTIA expects me to; but I do expect to be able to look up what I don't remember, and that's every bit as important as remembering every operating system's boot sequence.
I don't have my brainbench certs listed. I have a reference to my brainbench transcript and my transcript number so that an employer can look it up if he wants to. I may take the suggestion of removing it and using it in the follow-up letter, but that will make my credentials section look pretty pitiful. | |
| enforcer 2005-06-01, 8:06 am |
| Holy resurrected threads Batman!
Looks like someone's got hold of that time machine again  | |
| yanqui 2005-06-01, 10:53 am |
| quote:
Originally posted by enforcer
Holy resurrected threads Batman!
Looks like someone's got hold of that time machine again
Can it make me young and pretty again? | |
| enforcer 2005-06-01, 12:58 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by yanqui
Can it make me young and pretty again?
Again?  | |
| yanqui 2005-06-01, 1:08 pm |
| That was just uncalled for! :P | |
| enforcer 2005-06-01, 1:14 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by yanqui
That was just uncalled for! :P
But perfectly set up and executed | |
| curiousgeorge 2005-06-03, 3:28 am |
| I've never heard of Brain Bench until I read this thread. I wouldn't put them on a resume unless you're looking for a Helpdesk type job.
I'm in the process of hiring some desktop support people for our company. Some of the important things to keep your resume from being trashed:
1. Match your skills with the skills listed on the job announcement- this is key. When describing positions on your resume- don't throw in one line that relates to the job you're applying for, then waste 20 lines describing skills completely unrelated to the job. Make sure each job description on your resume clearly relates to the skills needed in the position you're applying for. If I'm hiring a desktop support position, that's the experience I look for on the resume.
2. Be specific with what you support. List how many computers/servers you support, the computer manufacturer, the specific OS's, and specific services you administer. Comments like "troubleshoot all computers and periferals on the network" are too vague. It would be better to have a few lines that state "Provide hardware support for 200 users in one location that use Dell and HP desktops as well as HP and Lexmark deskjet and laser printers" and "Provide software support for computers running Windows 98\2000\XP, Microsoft Office, Lotus Notes, and Norton Antivirus"
3. Avoid fluff- it's a negative. Don't inflate your experience. And don't list 30 different things you've "mastered" when there are only 2 on that list that you've ever worked with. Don't list every college course or every training class you've ever attended. (I actually had someone list 2 pages of training classes they took over the last ten years... and they didn't have a single cert.)
4. If you have a Additional Skills/ Professional Knowledge section on your resume, don't list a load of things unrelated to the job you're applying for. In a resume for a desktop support position, someone listed half a dozen different programming languages they "mastered", a dozen different models of Cisco routers and switches they could configure, 4 Cisco certs, and a laundry list of protocols they "mastered". That's great experience... but not for the job they applied for.
And when you get an interview: YOUR PERSONALITY SELLS. Skills on your resume got you the interview, your personality gets you the job. Be positive, be truthful, be polite, show eagerness to learn and an ability to solve things on your own, and give examples of how your experience matches the skills needed in the job. Respond to any deficiency in your skills with an eagerness to expand your knowledge into that area.
Hope that helps. | |
| yanqui 2005-06-03, 11:07 am |
| That's the kind of advice you can't get from a resume "specialist!"
Now let me ask you this: My support experience has all been intermittant, on-call, sort of very casual. I'm certified and I'm good, and it's my soft skills that make me different from everyone else that will apply for the job. I think I've done a good job of emphasizing the customer-relationship aspect of my service. But I also participate in computer support forums so I can get some more experience in troubleshooting and providing assistance to very inexperienced users. For someone who has never held a technical support position, but is looking to change careers, is that going to support my position that I am capable of helping solve computer problems, or would that seem like a greenhorn trying to pump up the resume and failing miserably? | |
| curiousgeorge 2005-06-04, 5:10 am |
| If you're trying to land your first job in IT, apply for Helpdesk type positions. And put on your cover letter that you are looking to make a career change into IT. Highlight your cert(s), your active participation in IT forums, and that you assist in troubleshooting problems at your work.
Tailer your resume to reflect the skills needed in a Helpdesk position. i.e.
Provide hardware troubleshooting assistance for desktops and printers for 30 users in my department.
Provide troubleshooting assistance for Windows 2000/XP, Microsoft Office, email clients, etc.
Assist 30 users in my department when training is needed for software applications.
Maintain a positive attitude while assisting novice users in my department with computer problems.
You don't have to have an IT job to assist users with computer issues. List on your resume what you do as it relates to IT first, then in one or two lines list your other responsibilities. The big thing here is to be honest. If you don't actually help your whole department with their computer problems (like in the examples above) then don't claim that you do on your resume.
Put a section on your resume like Additional Skills or Professional Knowledge and list your certs and any on-the-side jobs you've had related to IT.
Those are the things that would catch my eye if I was hiring a Helpdesk or entry level technician position.
Hope that helps. |
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