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Home > Archive > General Discussion > June 2003 > RIAA getting serious?
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RIAA getting serious?
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| Boulware5 2003-06-26, 9:47 pm |
| From their web site:
Recording Industry To Begin Collecting Evidence And Preparing Lawsuits Against File "Sharers" Who Illegally Offer Music Online
WASHINGTON (June 25, 2003) -- Starting tomorrow, the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA) will begin gathering evidence and preparing lawsuits against individual computer users who are illegally offering to "share" substantial amounts of copyrighted music over peer-to-peer networks. In making the announcement, the music industry cited its multi-year effort to educate the public about the illegality of unauthorized downloading, and underscored the fact that major music companies have made vast catalogues of music available to dozens of services to help create legitimate, high quality and inexpensive alternatives to online piracy.
"The law is clear and the message to those who are distributing substantial quantities of music online should be equally clear --- this activity is illegal, you are not anonymous when you do it, and engaging in it can have real consequences," said RIAA president Cary Sherman. "We'd much rather spend time making music then dealing with legal issues in courtrooms. But we cannot stand by while piracy takes a devastating toll on artists, musicians, songwriters, retailers and everyone in the music industry."
The RIAA expects to use the data it collects as the basis for filing what could ultimately be thousands of lawsuits charging individual peer-to-peer music distributors with copyright infringement. The first round of suits could take place as early as mid-August.
Over the past year, the industry has responded to consumer demand by making its music available to a wide range of authorized online subscription, streaming and download services that make it easier than ever for fans to get music legally and inexpensively on the Internet. Moreover, these services offer music reliably, in the highest sound quality, and without the risks of exposure to viruses or other undesirable material.
Federal law and the federal courts have been quite clear on what is not legal. It is illegal to make available for download copyrighted works without permission of the copyright owner. Court decisions have affirmed this as well. In the recent Grokster decision, for example, the court confirmed that the users of that system were guilty of copyright infringement. And in last year's Aimster decision, the judge wrote that the idea that "ongoing, massive, and unauthorized distribution and copying of copyrighted works somehow constitutes 'personal use' is specious and unsupported."
"Once we begin our evidence-gathering process, any individual computer user who continues to offer music illegally to millions of others will run the very real risk of facing legal action in the form of civil lawsuits that will cost violators thousands of dollars and potentially subject them to criminal prosecution," said Sherman.
To gather evidence against P2P users who make illegal downloading possible, the RIAA will be using software that scans the public directories available to any user of a peer-to-peer network. These directories, which allow users to find the material they are looking for, list all the files that other users of the network are currently offering to distribute. When the software finds a user who is offering to distribute copyrighted music files, it downloads some of the infringing files, along with the date and time it accessed the files.
Additional information that is publicly available from these systems allows the RIAA to then identify their Internet Service Provider (ISP). The RIAA can then serve a subpoena on the ISP requesting the name and address of the individual whose account was being used to distribute copyrighted music. Under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), ISPs must provide copyright holders with such information when there is reason to believe copyrights are being infringed. Almost all ISPs disclose this obligation in the User's Terms of Service.
Music industry leaders, along with an unprecedented coalition of other groups like the National Music Publishers’ Association (NMPA), the Country Music Association, the Gospel Music Association, the American Federation of Television and Radio Artists (AFTRA), American Federation of Musicians, songwriters, recording artists, retailers, and record companies have been educating music fans that the epidemic of illegal file sharing not only robs songwriters and recording artists of their livelihoods, it also undermines the future of music itself by depriving the industry of the resources it needs to find and develop new talent. In addition, it threatens the jobs of tens of thousands of less celebrated people in the music industry, from engineers and technicians to warehouse workers and record store clerks.
This message has been conveyed to the public in a series of print and broadcast ads featuring top recording artists. And, in the past two months, millions of Instant Messages were sent directly to infringers on the Kazaa and Grokster peer-to-peer file-sharing networks. | |
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| good, get rid of all the wannabe leech and we can get back to the good old day of ftp/newsgroup/irc where the real boys play. | |
| Boulware5 2003-06-26, 9:55 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by mikop
good, get rid of all the wannabe leech and we can get back to the good old day of ftp/newsgroup where the real boys play.
ftps/newsgroups is the way to go.  | |
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| i edited and included irc, that's valid too. the rest of the p2p crowd is just poseurs | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-26, 9:58 pm |
| I shall have to be paid very well to participate in this industry. | |
| Boulware5 2003-06-26, 10:09 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by mikop
i edited and included irc, that's valid too. the rest of the p2p crowd is just poseurs
xdcc! nuff' said. | |
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| mikop 2003-06-26, 10:14 pm |
| I just wanna share the lyric of the warez song, it is a classic.
The Warez Song
The day I got hooked up to the mighty internet
I was taken to a world that I'd never forget
Websites, chat rooms, IRC and live video streams
Online multimedia that looked like LSD dreams
Then I got my hands on something called CuteFTP
I was told that I could have what I wanted for free
Went on to some guy's FTP, 1 to 4 ratio
Uploaded my swap file and downloaded Super Mario
Then I heard of something that was called an MP3 Player
Had something to do with music, compression and layer
Didn't give a damn about the facts given to me
Just wanted to download songs without buying the CD
Later I found Vivo movies compressed on the net
Downloaded one movie per night, as much as I could get
Titanic took a couple more but less for wet and wild
It was like Christmas every day and I was some rich man's child
But soon enough the downloads had to come straight back to me
Turns out it was the feds who ran that awesome FTP
Were setting up a trap for all us online criminals
They said "XXXX free speech it's corrupted our youth it's all a load of bull"
One more game, one more app, one more serial and one more crack
Warez are the only thing for me One more game,
one more app, one more serial and one more crack
Could someone give the crack for Duke3D
DCC's something IRC gives to everyone
Need a crack for Paint Shop Pro, in seconds, download's done
Stupid people buy domains with warez in the name
When they're shut down I am pissed off but they're the ones to blame
Quake2 came out in Denmark 2 days `fore the USA
But thanks to FTPing I had my copy in a day
Unreal was just that, Unreal, on my bandwidth supply
Took 3 weeks to get it, it sucked, and I asked myself why
Got a CD burner with just 2 uses in mind
To download, copy and burn everything that I could find
And sell the discs to friends for only 7 bucks a pop
5 bucks for the disc, 2 bucks for my time, 7 bucks for Photoshop
Pisses me off when I'm searching for something that's hard to find
I find a link to get a copy but Netscape is blind
Says can't find file or something lame which doesn't help me out
But 3 days later I get it and it removes all my doubts
Cops find out, it's the second time, this time I go to jail
Not only am I broke, no PC, but warez plans have failed
I'm sitting in the slammer going to warez me a great big ginsu knife (What the hell was I thinking with this one?!?)
I'll be here with the next ten years can I warez a wife? (Ditto) One more game,
one more app, one more serial and one more crack
Warez are the only thing for me
One more game, one more app, one more serial and one more crack Could someone get the crack for Duke3D So I don't need the CD - Musical Interlude- One more game, one more app, one more serial and one more crack Someone get the crack for Duke3D for me oh please | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-26, 10:26 pm |
| Where do I live? You'll have to buy that information from somebody else.
How much power do I use? You'll have to buy that information from somebody else.
How much money do I have? You'll have to buy that information from somebody else.
What is my phone number? You'll have to buy that information from somebody else.
Where do I spend my money? You'll have to buy that information from somebody else.
Anything else under the sun you want to know about me? You'll have to buy it from somebody else.
Why? because I dont sell personal information about myself, you will have to get that from somebody who STOLE IT FROM ME!, maybe you can buy it from RIAA or KAZAA! | |
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| mikop 2003-06-26, 10:32 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by me? I dunno...
from somebody who STOLE IT FROM ME, maybe you can buy it from RIAA or KAZAA!
FCUK RIAA FCUK KAZAA!
interesting... and what are you doing on kazaa?
this is the thing that gets me... no style... the romance of it is all gone...
don't be shy, you are not in a court... be straight about what you are doing... the other bs is just that for the lawyer...
you are ripping movies, musics, software... no if about it... you are STEALING it... serves you right to have your info sold WITHOUT your consent.
my god...
and your earlier statement about them STEALING your bandwidth? laugh...
this is how much the computer/internet population has deteriorated and to think that there are those who believe in the principal of it all that's fighitng for YOUR internet rights... | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-26, 10:35 pm |
| I listen to the music I get, (that somebody has already paid for) whereas information 'squeezed' out of me is sold for profit.
I'm not breaking into anybody's house to get tunes. | |
| prezbedard 2003-06-26, 10:53 pm |
| What about the tatics that the RIAA is employing? I have read articles on the fact that the RIAA doesn't even need a judge to get a supena. The advocating of destroying users computer as in this article The destruction of personal property is also against the law. I believe the RIAA has too much power to do as they please. That is my main concern. Protecting copyrights is one thing but what the RIAA is doing is far beyond that. | |
| mikop 2003-06-26, 10:55 pm |
| nt | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-26, 10:59 pm |
| and god saed, 'let them children rip and boogie...' | |
| mikop 2003-06-26, 11:07 pm |
| nt... again... | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-26, 11:12 pm |
| quote:
and god saed, 'let them children rip and boogie...'
That of course from scriptures, I believe it was the book of little richard... | |
| ccieToBe 2003-06-27, 12:40 am |
| In related news, SCO is now suing the RIAA for copying its business model. | |
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| There are already invetigations under way to try to prove that RIAA has uploaded 'harmful' files and allowed people to leech them. As far as I am concerned that is terrorism and they should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
My own personal take on this is that I have and will download many tunes from new bands to have a quick listen, and when I find a band that actually has more than one or two songs worth listening to I buy the CD. I also download many bands that are not available in my country - kind of hard to know if something is worth while listening to if it gets no airplay. Since I started using this method I have purchased over 200 CDs for my collection - I am thinking that without listening to them prior my collection would have only increased by 5 or 10.
You guys stateside can XXXXX and moan, but over here a new release can cost $30/$35 a pop. Hence I purchase a lot over the net and pay a fair whack of shipping costs, but still land them up to 50% cheaper.
Dime to a dozen that if CDs were priced even somewhere appropriately people would buy more, and if DVDs were also priced at a fair price and not subject to that hocus zone crap then sales would definitely improve. Hell I can buy a VCR of The Wall by Pink Floyd for $20, but the DVD is $45 - bullshit!!
Another XXXXX - if record companies actually paid the artists a respectable figure then perhaps that would also aid with their PR. Giving a band a whopping $1 royalty per CD is awesome ........ until they get the bill for recording the CD - that bill is usually as much as they can expect to earn from sales .... totally hocus. | |
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| so let's see.
your justification for it is
1. they are over priced... if they are priced fairly, then we won't have to rip them off with downloads.
2. they don't pay their artists fairly... if they had, then we would gladly pay to support the artists.
and you don't see what's wrong with that argument?
first, what is *fair price*? the price you would want to spend, the price the market will bear? certainly the price fixing does not help... but certainly any price would be consider over priced... how many would volunatarily pay a buck for a song like apple's online music scheme when they can download it free? we have already come up with excuses of why apple's system is inconvenient...
second, last time I checked, there is no restriction on lawyer availability to artists... they made bad business deal... whopee... Also... who lives the fast life with fast women? in almost all cases where the artist became broke... it has always been because they spent their money on their associate/pose, they are into drugs, they engage in bad business deals... let me gather myself to shed a tear to all the rock stars out there... and let me shed a tear for all the money I should have to pay to sing the happy birthday song because I want to support them in their fight over royalties with the record companies... who should I send the check to for all the birthday song sung in my honor (a whopping 30 of them)?... artist or record label...
terrorism? that's overly simplistic... you are willingly engaged in what they perceive as an illegal act in ripping them off... why can't they protect themselves? if you find someone hacking your network and you fight back, are you them liable for any damaged done to the hacker's system? I know I sure will nuke the sh*t out of him if I am given the go rather than the standard log, report, let the authorities handle it procedure.
Am I for RIAA? certainly not, but some of the conclusion and parrallel we draw is too simplistic and based on arousing emotion and sensationalizing it (oh my god, this is an act of terrorism, since terrorism is bad, this is bad, since x then y, then z and then this never ends... and the original premise is lost in all the smoke) rather than address the issue... | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-27, 2:54 am |
| quote:
if you find someone hacking your network and you fight back, are you them liable for any damaged done to the hacker's system
just a friendly question, 'who gave riaa ownership of the internet?' | |
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| And if you read right through you would see that I actually PURCHASED about 180 more CDs than I would have if I didn't sample them from the net.
Secondly, I am talking about new and/or obscure artists that are trying to get a break (any break) and a recording contract is very often thrust under their nose just after they have finished a gig and more often than not they get the "This is a once only offer that expires when I leave the room". Mostly these are kids who quite possibly have never spoken to a lawyer except maybe for a traffic violation.
Most recording companies are run by people who have very little in the way of business ethics and a lot of what they do is illegal in many countries, but because they are mostly viewed as respectable business people they get away with it. I'd like to elaborate a little, but it appears I am to be a witness for the prosecution against a few of those slime so I better keep it generalised.
Now about nuking a hacker - in many countries YOU would definitely be breaking the law. I was reading in an industry magazine where sometime last year a guy who was hacked had a friend repay the compliment. However the hacker was just a script kiddie using his dads machine and the old man had business stuff on his machine that was destroyed - the dad being a very expensive lawyer was totally pissed and with the aid of his ISP managed to track down the other guy. The defense that he was just getting back at someone who hacked him didn't hold much water and the judge made a comment along the lines of "vigalante justice is illegal - therefore no matter what the provocation, you are found guilty" The fine was rather large.
Now talk about oversimplifying things - my comment was that if CDs were reasonably priced then perhaps people would have less incentive to pirate them. And talking about piracy, I really don't have too much problem with someone downloading music to listen to on their computer for a reasonable fee (not apples buck a song) - I equate it to the royalties paid by radio stations for playing music .... ohhhhh yes, another area where the small bands get stiffed. They get paid royalties for CDs sold, but very rarely for airtime royalties - again another area where music companies 'forget' to write something into the contract.
I could go on, but I think I might just go out and listen to a poor band who has been stiffed. | |
| ruscorp 2003-06-27, 10:20 am |
| Back to the EFnet underground I see.  | |
| mikop 2003-06-27, 10:21 am |
| oh I read about all your cd purchases, however, for ever instances where music pirating does help in cd sale, there are a lot more who would not purchase the cd. Listen to the discussion here, you think me? I dunno? purchase the cd?
This sort of blend into why I really do not care for p2p, or for the popularity is has gotten... it is sort of like AOL... so easy every idiot can get their hands on it... And by their inclusion, their blantly *defense* of this act that is rightly theirs, "it is my right to download them because I can" attitude, I think it hijack some of the romance of it all... It is a noble to fight for free speech, but everytime I see some idiot use our first amendment to argue some rediculous point, mouths off, or to justify their racist or some other offensive remark, I wish we actually live in a draconian society where the obvious wrong can just be drag away and dealt with.
I don't think the lack of business ethic is any more prominent in the recording industry than others...
The legal issue is unclear, and that's the whole point of this aspect of the fight against RIAA... However, since you are security focused, would you honestly say that if you find someone actively snooping on your network, that you really really prefer to just sit back and build a case against him, rather then the urge of frying him? I know what I do, I also know that I really really want to do otherwise... because his messing with my stuff.
Now, in regard to RIAA's situation, I liken it to this... I put some files on my box, you downloaded it by your own free will, it exploded... too bad so sad... I didn't force you to download it. And let's be real about it, when you download *# 1 song in the country*, there is no mistake about what you are actively engaged in... you didn't think that's an open license pamplet about music appreciation...
who gives them the right to the internet? al gore... but seriously... why would they need explicit permission (again, the legality of it is much more beyond this)... they are not putting destructive program in the hulk movie you just downloaded or photoshop 7, they are using it and disguising it as songs that they hold a rights to... your downloading it and attempts to play it are in their opinion an act of blantant piracy and at that point, you somehow lost the rights to the claim because you have actively engage in a crime in which too bad so sad, you got the wrong thing. | |
| ruscorp 2003-06-27, 10:49 am |
| Is mikop running for office anytime soon? | |
| enforcer 2003-06-27, 11:22 am |
| No I think he's going for at least two awards in the Examnotes Members of the year Awards  | |
| ruscorp 2003-06-27, 11:29 am |
| Doesn't he get disgusted by people like us? | |
| jason892 2003-06-27, 11:34 am |
| quote:
Originally posted by mikop
who gives them the right to the internet? al gore... but seriously... why would they need explicit permission (again, the legality of it is much more beyond this)... they are not putting destructive program in the hulk movie you just downloaded or photoshop 7, they are using it and disguising it as songs that they hold a rights to... your downloading it and attempts to play it are in their opinion an act of blantant piracy and at that point, you somehow lost the rights to the claim because you have actively engage in a crime in which too bad so sad, you got the wrong thing.
The problem with that is that it is illegal to booby trap anything in this country. You can't put a board with nails through it in your yard to keep people from driving over the corner of your yard. The only way you won't be liable for a burglar that gets mauled by your attack dog is if you plainly post a "beware of dog" sign at every entrance(and even then you better have a dam good attorney). | |
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| it is illegal to fart in someone's face in this country because it violates their personal space and constitute an invasion of their privacy... 
the good fights needs to be fought, but I can certainly not feel good about it being hi-jacked by some 2 bit wannabe. | |
| Forsaken 2003-06-27, 1:33 pm |
| quote:
Originally posted by mikop
it is illegal to fart in someone's face in this country because it violates their personal space and constitute an invasion of their privacy
Even if they are downwind? | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-27, 2:16 pm |
| If its a pickles and cream cheese on stoned wheat thin fart, I'll be expecting my royalty check to show up soon.
That or I'll blow up your house. | |
| me? I dunno... 2003-06-27, 2:38 pm |
| Excuse me, I have to go, the RIAA goons are here and they are going through all of my personal effects and checking every room of my house. You see its my legal obligation to allow them to do so, I will be busy showing them around for a while, it seems they are interested in knowing evrything about every aspect of my life and I have no right to stop them...
You see, a friend lent me a tape 22 years ago, just before leaving the country unexpectedly, the RRIA internet spies have caught wind of this and... oops, I have to go again... (anal probe), oh well, I guess they have the right... | |
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| Interesting take you have on the recording industry MIKOP, however I have rarely come across any other industry where the norm is the supplying of illicit narcotics - the supply of prostitues - the supply of alcohol to minors. This crap happens all the time in recording studios all over the world, and will always continue as long as young kids are making music and allowed to be conned by those scum.
Now if RIAA went out and tried to clean up their members I just may feel a little my sympathetic about their plight. I also know that if they got their crap together and looked around they would find many other ways to combat piracy. As an example I was in Malaysia recently and sighted many stalls selling unreleased (in my country) DVDs for as little as US $5 and CDs for between $1 and $4. Hell, in one place there were about 20/25,000 playstation games. These are the places that seriously kill the profitability of the various companies and not the kid who downloads the occasional MP3 or DivX | |
| jonhiker 2003-06-27, 5:38 pm |
| In my opinion..
I don't see a difference between P2P sharing of song files and the old-fashioned way of copying to tape/CD a song from an LP/CD/45
and giving it to a friend/few friends. Other than the obvious, it's a whole lot more people. If the recording industry wouldn't charge so much for the CD, more folks might buy them.
something smells like cream cheese...wind must be coming out of the north |
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